Dr. Jennifer Young Wallace—Leaving a STAMP on Education and Her ATE Presidency (Part 2 of 2)

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Oh, so that the strands in the
in the conference were stamped

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social, emotional learning,
transformational leadership.

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So when people applied or or
proposed, it was centered around

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that.
I had an opportunity to drop in

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on some sessions.
I was flawed at how this thing

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was resonating and and even to
hear someone may have chosen A

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multiculturalism and how they
were reiterate, you know, if

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we're going to leave a stamp on
this.

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Even though they were discussing
their research, they found ways

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to bring it back to why their
research is important.

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Not just to present, not just to
get tenure and promotion.

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This research is to empower.
And maybe the ones who are

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listening to me, when you leave
my session, you are in not only

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empowered, but you have a step.
I've left a step, an impression

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on you to take this work to the
next level.

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This is Nicholas.
Hartlett, Robert Charles

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Billings Endowed Chair and
Education at Berea College.

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notes.

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Welcome, welcome.
Welcome to Add Up Accelerated

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Excellence, the podcast for the
advancement of educational

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excellence and equity.
And I'm your host, Jacob Easley,

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the second PhD PMP.
And today's guest is the

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wonderful doctor, Doctor
Jennifer Young Wallace.

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She is the immediate past
president of the Association of

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Teacher Educators or ATE, and is
an associate professor at

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Jackson State University.
Thank you for tuning into the

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second part of our conversation
with Doctor Wallace, where she

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continues to explain the
complexities of National

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Association leadership and the
growing diversification of

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engagement by members across
different types of universities.

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Thank you, Doctor Easley.
I am Jennifer Young Wallace.

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I am an associate professor of
leadership at Jackson State

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University, one of our premier
HBC US.

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I'm also Faculty Senate
President there where we are

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really interested in in the
future of higher education.

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So today I am excited to share
with you some of my vision and

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some of my experience in
education.

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Presently as as as Doctor Easley
stated, I am the immediate past

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president of ATE and it was a
fabulous year of reiterating to

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educators as we train educators
to leave a stamp on education,

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leave a stamp on education.
So my national theme was

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empowering a global community of
leaders to lead a stamp.

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Stamp is an acronym STAMP on
Education asks for social

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emotional learning, T for
transformational leadership, A

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for advocacy, M for
multiculturalism, and P for

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professional practices.
I'm so excited about that work

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because that work is extending
into a a model, a model for

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leaders and a model for
teachers.

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I think that every leader, every
teacher needs to be intentional

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about leaving a stamp on
education.

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So Jennifer, I, I want to make
sure that we can have a balanced

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perspective on this.
I'm so glad to hear about how

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your theme of leaving a stamp
resonated with folks and and was

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translated into the themes or
the the the framework for the

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conference itself.
But I also want folks to be to

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be aware that leadership is not
is sometimes can be difficult.

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So what were most, what were
some of the most challenging

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aspects of stepping into the
presidency at ATE and how did

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you navigate those challenges
during your leadership in that

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position?
So as as education is changing

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in America, so is ATE.
So we have a new set of bylaws

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and going into a presidency,
there are so many things that

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can that need to be done right.
And you have a year.

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So you are trying to work your
vision with your commissions and

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with with your thing, but you
also have the business of the

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other organization.
So as a leader, what I had to

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realize that I had a year.
What are some priorities that I

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can bite off because there could
be 101 things to do, but what

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are those things that you feel
are readily available to address

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or those things that that need
to be addressed at this point?

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What are some things that are
way behind?

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So in speaking with the CEO, we
got together, we talked about

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some things that needed to be
done.

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So we, we, we, we made sure that
we have our five year report

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because those, the, those types
of documents are important when

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you are being audited or when
you are trying to move forward

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to write for grants, like what
has this Organism done over the

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past years?
So we were able to to get that

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five year report and thanks to
Doctor Lisa Chapman, the CEO,

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the work was done.
So again, picking those things,

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I'm talking about the governance
piece now, because you're still

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doing all your work with your
presidency and your vision.

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But the governance piece or the
OR the operational piece, you

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have to choose those things that
you can accomplish.

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And as my my my advice to the
incoming president was this, you

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see a whole lot of things that
need to be done that need to be

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addressed.
Choose those things that are

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most important to you.
Bite off go that those pieces

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and make sure that those pieces
come to fruition.

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And even though there were 101
things I would have loved to

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have done in my presidency, a
good leader recognizes that

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priority is essential.
Otherwise you have so many

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moving pieces that nothing gets
done so that so so, so some.

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The main challenge was what
pieces do I really want to bite

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off because I really want to eat
the whole apple, but but it's

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just not feasible in this one
year time.

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So as a leader, I had to to work
with the CEO to see what, what

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her vision was from the
operational perspective and see

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how we as a board and I as a
president can ensure that this

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work gets done or work with them
to get this work done.

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So that that was the biggest
challenge because my personality

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will want to get it all done.
But but but leadership, good

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leadership recognizes that
priority is necessary and it's

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OK for the next person to come
in and pick up and move a move

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on with whatever was left behind
and then the person after her.

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That's how that that's how you
build a tower.

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So I like this idea of building
a tower.

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And as you were speaking, it
made me think about something

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heaven set on set on boards for
for associations had leadership

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roles.
And when it comes to conference

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making each year there's often a
new theme.

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As you just mentioned, the new
president has heard theme.

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I'm wondering if you talked
about how you anchored your

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thing by going back into the
Chronicles, looking at the older

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things.
So it makes me wonder, sometimes

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it can feel a bit schizophrenic.
So you'll see a theme that says

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one thing this year, the next
theme is something else.

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And then the third year it sort
of Harkins back to the year

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before.
How do we as folks who have

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associations and you're
developing this work for member

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engagement and community
engagement, particularly around

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our conferences, how do we
ensure that some level of

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continuity?
Because if we in some ways just

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leave one thing for one year and
go to a completely different

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focus, are we driving continuity
or are we, as you mentioned

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earlier, as a leader spreading
ourselves too thinly across too

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many different interests?
And what is the ongoing impact

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from conference to conference
based around this this

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conference making enterprise?
That is an excellent question.

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And that is why I created an
initial task force on

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presidential presidentials. 10
years, 10 years.

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I'm sorry.
So what, what, what, what I did

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when I was when I became
president, I went back into, I

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guess you could say the archives
and look what some things were.

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I saw a recurrence of advocacy
over the years.

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So a lot of things are not new.
I remember, I remember when

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multiculturalism and diversity
was really hidden in American

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education.
You will see several things

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around multiculturalism.
You will see several things that

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that may not have said
professional practices, but they

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were related.
They were professional

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practices.
So you are seeing, you are

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seeing some, you'll see
inconsistency, but word it in a

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different way because of the
trend or the politics policies

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of that time, right.
So when I went back, I saw

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things and I saw some general,
some general descriptions and I

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was like you, how do we get
continuity?

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Because I would like to know why
this person chose this thing

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which I could not find because
there was there were

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descriptions.
But why did Doctor Kerry

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Robinson, who was president from
from new president from New

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York, the state of New York?
Why did Doctor Karen Genlick

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choose her theme?
Who was from Texas?

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Why did Doctor Nancy Gallivan
choose her theme or Doctor

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Shirley Lafever choose her
theme?

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Why did they choose them?
So I was not able to see the

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why, but I saw a thing.
I saw the error and I saw a

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brief description which could,
which was indicative.

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So as a result of that, I saw
the task force.

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We have about 20 living
presidents right now.

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We we have a questionnaire that
has gone out and Doctor Liz

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Ward, Doctor Kristen McIntyre,
who's the past president who

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started work on AT ES History,
and Doctor Barbara Cassidy

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Perman from from Texas.
All of them are from Texas.

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They are working with this
initiative, right?

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That that that falls under my
presidency.

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We are going back to ask those
presidents, why did you choose

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this thing?
What was happening in America at

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that time that impacted your
theme?

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What were your commissions and
why were they important to you?

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So 200 years from now, when,
when, when, when, when our

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relatives are great grands,
great, great, great, great,

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great, etcetera.
Go back and do research.

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They will have a, a, a more
precise understanding of the

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world of education for their
time because presidential themes

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are built around whether we
vocalize it or not, but there is

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something innate that help us
choose our things based on what

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we're experiencing in the world
during that time.

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So, so that's why that
initiative was set, that task

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force was set in place so that
we can be more specific,

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specific.
And maybe in the future, when

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the president comes in and reads
about the why for these things,

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they can have a better
understanding of why it is

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important to choose things that
are relevant.

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And, and, and, and, and, and I,
and I do believe that presidents

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have chosen things that are
relevant, but they really now

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have an intentional
understanding about why these

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things were implemented during
those presidencies.

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Thank you for that, that, that,
that, that that solidified.

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That really makes me feel good
that this task force is

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important for someone who didn't
even know and to ask the

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question that I asked when I was
president and could not find a

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lot of information.
I just had general explanations.

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Now we are delving in to get
specifics.

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Thank you for that question.
You're welcome.

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That I think that's just a
really good, perhaps not in the

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same format that you're talking
about, but I think it's a really

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good suggestion for
organizations to have a brief on

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the context for the development
of that theme for that

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particular year.
So as you mentioned, I think

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yes, the time or the context
does shape how we think about

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what the theme might be, which
really Harkins back to this idea

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that all politics are personal.
And what I mean by personal

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means that the context, so you
may not be directly impacted,

229
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:42,600
but you know folks are impacted
by the the contemporary context

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00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:47,440
and so and what your peers and
community members are feeling

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00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:51,360
and seeing and how they're
responding to the context.

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00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:56,160
So yes, all of those decisions
in some ways are very personal

233
00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:59,160
in that regard.
So you've made as you mentioned

234
00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:03,360
earlier, increasing HBC your
representation within ATA

235
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:07,880
priority through finessing as
you mentioned early relationship

236
00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:13,079
building.
So why is this, Why would you

237
00:17:13,079 --> 00:17:17,000
say this focus is so important
for the future of the

238
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:21,079
organization given that I
believe you alluded to there

239
00:17:21,079 --> 00:17:27,760
were in some states very few are
very limited engagement of HBC

240
00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:31,760
us with ATE?
Yes, across the nation it's it's

241
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:35,680
very few.
I had never heard of ATE until

242
00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:39,400
2013.
ATE has been around since 1920.

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00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:43,320
As a matter of fact, I think in
the 70s, ATE had his first

244
00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:47,600
president from Mississippi.
He was from Mississippi State, a

245
00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:49,800
white male from Mississippi
State.

246
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:55,360
I never heard of ATE.
As I talk to colleges of

247
00:17:55,360 --> 00:17:59,440
education Deans and professors
who are working at those

248
00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:02,680
universities, a lot of them
don't know anything about ATEI

249
00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:04,520
have been there for their
introduction to it.

250
00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:10,080
So commissions usually kick off
after your presidency because

251
00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:12,200
you have three years to work
with them.

252
00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:15,960
So we are just surging into this
work because during that year

253
00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:19,400
you are you have so many things
going on and you're still trying

254
00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:22,280
to build and see how your
Commission is going to be

255
00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:24,760
beneficial to the organization
in the long run.

256
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:30,560
So again, commissions are are
based on interests that are

257
00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:34,920
that, that that help move the
organization to the next level

258
00:18:35,360 --> 00:18:40,600
based on the trends of the time.
And so having we are a, an

259
00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:45,920
organization of diversity where
where we we support the, the,

260
00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,440
the, the different diverse
cultures and leadership styles,

261
00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:54,480
etcetera.
So they ate embraced that the

262
00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:56,320
board thought it was a good
idea.

263
00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:59,160
Of course, they you get your
vetting from the board for your

264
00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:01,480
Commission.
So now this work will begin.

265
00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:05,160
Doctor Edith Davison from FAMU
is leading this charge.

266
00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:09,760
And we are we are getting ready
to have our first meeting in

267
00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:12,160
late April.
We're starting with a group of

268
00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:15,400
Deans from different HBC us that
have colleges of education

269
00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:19,800
because not all HBC US have
degrees in education.

270
00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:23,560
So we're starting with those
colleges of education that may

271
00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:27,480
also have be a College of social
science education and

272
00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,480
psychology.
But again, education is embedded

273
00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:32,280
in there.
So we're starting those

274
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,880
conversations with those Deans
and chairs to to share with them

275
00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:43,360
the the importance of Ates of
impact on on their faculty and

276
00:19:43,360 --> 00:19:47,000
how their faculty can grow.
So we're hoping to launch our

277
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:51,400
first gathering in Seattle at
the conference of where Doctor

278
00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:55,560
Valerie Wright from Saint Leo
University is the president.

279
00:19:55,800 --> 00:20:00,200
So this work will continue and
hopefully we can we can emerge

280
00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:04,360
into a sig where where HBCU
faculty.

281
00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:09,960
And again I stressed HBCU.
We are not saying black teachers

282
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:12,160
or African American teachers and
educators.

283
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:16,520
We are seeing faculty from HBCUS
so like them.

284
00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:19,800
You is very diverse.
Tennessee State is very diverse.

285
00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:22,560
The Jackson State's faculty is
very diverse.

286
00:20:22,960 --> 00:20:28,000
It's so it's not about the race
of the university, university's

287
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,760
faculty.
It's about the category of the

288
00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:37,360
university, the HBCU, the MSI.
So we're starting with HBC US

289
00:20:37,360 --> 00:20:42,040
and then we're moving to Ms. is
having those representations at

290
00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:45,160
ATE.
So I just wanted to stress that

291
00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:48,720
because our faculty are very
diverse and our faculty, the

292
00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:54,000
goal is to get representation
from HBC US regardless of the

293
00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:56,480
ethnic background of the
faculty.

294
00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:02,880
So, you know, my heart is worn
by this description.

295
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:06,040
And I'm saying this because, and
I've never actually shared this

296
00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:10,320
before, but my first ATE
conference I attended as a

297
00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:13,440
doctoral student, I was at the
Pennsylvania State University.

298
00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:18,280
We were receiving an award for
our partnership in educated

299
00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:24,720
preparation.
And I remember as a young

300
00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:27,920
African American doctoral
student, I'm not going to say

301
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:33,600
young doctoral student, African
American male doctoral student,

302
00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:36,120
attending this conference for
the first time.

303
00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:41,920
It was a bit concerning for me
because, and maybe through my

304
00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:45,760
lens at that time, I found it to
be predominantly white,

305
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,280
predominantly in the leadership
role.

306
00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:55,200
It seemed like they were mostly
men and everyone seemed to be of

307
00:21:55,200 --> 00:22:00,440
a generation, one or two
generations my senior.

308
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:05,240
So it it, it, it was a strange
place to be in there.

309
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:11,560
What did I didn't see a lot of
junior or anymore individuals

310
00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:13,920
new to the profession.
I didn't see a lot of people who

311
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:17,720
look like me at the conference
and I think that may have had

312
00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:22,120
colored why.
I have attended ATE since a few

313
00:22:22,120 --> 00:22:26,200
years later, but it has not been
sort of the go to place for me

314
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:30,600
for a number of reasons.
But there's also a reason why I

315
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:34,840
went to ATEA A/C TE because my
institution had a stronger

316
00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:39,840
partnership with a ACTE in my
dog program and then getting

317
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:46,840
engaged, continue the work to my
current day professional role

318
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:49,800
and experiences.
So, but I will say that that

319
00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:53,480
first experience at ATE was
quite shocking and that was in

320
00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:59,360
the early 2000s.
So now here you talk about this

321
00:22:59,360 --> 00:23:02,280
ongoing working on professional,
professional relationship

322
00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:04,800
building.
In some ways, personal

323
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:09,960
relationship building but also
diversifying the voices at the

324
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:16,440
table really does speak volumes.
Yes, so, so the trends have

325
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:19,960
definitely changed.
We have an influx of younger

326
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:25,200
people.
We have a new commerce reception

327
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:30,640
and they are, they make me feel
old, right?

328
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:34,200
I was the, I was the almost 20
years, 15 years ago.

329
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:37,880
I was a younger one, right?
They make me feel feel old.

330
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:42,960
But but the, the trends have
changed and, and we have a, a

331
00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,840
large number of young professors
who are coming in.

332
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:51,960
We have, we saw, we are seeing
more African Americans register

333
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:55,080
and present at, at the
conference.

334
00:23:55,080 --> 00:24:00,680
But I, I do understand because
when I went in 20, 13, I did not

335
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,360
see a large representation from
African Americans.

336
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:09,080
As a matter of fact, when I was
elected to the board, I saw that

337
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,520
was a, an African American male
in attendance.

338
00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,120
So they introduced the board and
of course I stood.

339
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:18,480
He came up to me after the after
the session, the general

340
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:24,040
session, and said, Oh my God, I
am so excited to see a black

341
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:28,840
face on the board because I've
not seen that in a long time or

342
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,080
no, as a matter of fact, he said
he had never seen me.

343
00:24:31,360 --> 00:24:34,200
But I did share with him that
over the years there have been

344
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:39,600
some representation, maybe not
as frequently as, as you would

345
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,840
think, but those trends are
changing now.

346
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:46,920
They as a matter of fact, when
fact when I was president, there

347
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:51,520
were two other African Americans
on the board at some given time.

348
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:56,040
So, so the trends are changing
again.

349
00:24:56,400 --> 00:25:03,200
The I, I, I would hate for a
person from an HBCU or of, or of

350
00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:09,760
a minority ethnic background to
miss out on the opportunities

351
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:14,440
that ATE has to offer and, and,
and the professional, the

352
00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:19,080
opportunity for professional
growth to, to, to go to waste

353
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:24,560
because people don't see people
that look like them.

354
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:31,720
So that is one reason why my
task force or my Commission was

355
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:36,720
established so that people won't
be deterred from, from what

356
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:43,000
could be a pot of gold because
the gold may not be shining or,

357
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:48,320
or have the, or have the, or
have the color that you are

358
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:52,040
familiar with.
Because I understand I'm an

359
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:55,600
African American female.
I understand and, and I had the

360
00:25:55,600 --> 00:26:00,680
same thought.
But fortunately, by building

361
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:06,640
relationships, I really got to
see that this was a great

362
00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:09,720
opportunity to professional for
professional growth and

363
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:15,640
engagement and empowerment.
Being empowered to empower that

364
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,880
color kind of became the back in
the back of my mind.

365
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:25,480
But but as I began to emerge in
the operations of the

366
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:29,760
organization, it, it came back
to surface that OK, now is an

367
00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:34,280
opportunity to have more
visibilities from those HBC us

368
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:39,040
as well as from people of color,
even from the PWI because there

369
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:44,080
are people of color working at
PWI that are now also becoming

370
00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:47,000
more engaged in ATE.
Yeah.

371
00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:51,160
I want to extend that a bit
because it's making me think

372
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:56,200
about representation broadly.
So when we think about these the

373
00:26:56,200 --> 00:27:01,600
our traditional conference
making machine at some of the

374
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:05,600
large associations,
representation does matter.

375
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:12,000
But if you're in a traditional
organization, it's often it's

376
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:15,920
easy because as we talked about
context, your context is your

377
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,320
context and drives how you think
about your work.

378
00:27:19,120 --> 00:27:22,680
And they're folks who are in
other contexts such as community

379
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:29,080
colleges, as you mentioned
earlier, HBC, US, MSI, small

380
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,520
institutions, alternate route
institutions.

381
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:35,840
If you're in a large
institution, traditional

382
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:40,480
traditionally formed and then
traditional base preparation,

383
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:44,440
you're less likely to think
about those others because

384
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:49,240
that's not part of your lived
experience and daily work

385
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,320
environmental context.
So I think it's important that

386
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,720
we have to then think a bit
more.

387
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:59,200
We have that challenge ourselves
to think beyond where we

388
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:04,320
currently send sit and the
context in which we work to

389
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,360
expand ourselves and think about
others, particularly at at the

390
00:28:07,360 --> 00:28:10,320
national level.
And I believe that calls for

391
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:12,320
different types of
conversations.

392
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:16,880
So with that, I'm going to lead
us into a question about your

393
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,640
research.
So your research centers

394
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:25,200
critical race theory through the
lens of the Mississippi Black

395
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:27,560
Caucus, and that's one of your
projects.

396
00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:33,280
So how does scholarship grounded
in history and justice inform

397
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:38,680
your leadership in teaching and
administration in general?

398
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:43,320
So, so that research on critical
race theory, which is undergoing

399
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:46,360
and we got a lot of stuff that
we are looking forward to

400
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:50,360
implementing there, that
research reiterates the need to

401
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:55,120
advocate.
And the big question is how do

402
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,040
educators advocate?
Because right now there is a

403
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:02,040
fear factor that is prevalent,
right?

404
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:06,040
So, so, so for me in this
research, there is a need to

405
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:11,120
advocate.
There is also a need to, I

406
00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:16,920
think, to revisit what we're
arguing for.

407
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:24,080
Because personally, through my
research, I'm wondering why are

408
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:26,120
we calling it critical race
theory?

409
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:32,120
Because this also calling it
critical race theory appears to

410
00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:38,080
intimidate or claw the minds of
the people who are in place to

411
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:43,920
make these policies and and to
reinforce these bans, right?

412
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:48,120
Why are we calling it critical
race theorem?

413
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,800
It's authentic history.
Why are we?

414
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:57,680
Why are we saying, Oh well, we
want students to think

415
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:01,480
critically?
Well, we do want the student to

416
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:06,440
to think critically.
But but to me, history is based

417
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:11,160
on facts occurrences.
These things actually occurred.

418
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:17,040
Slavery occurred, the Black Wall
Street massacre, massacre

419
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:23,400
occurred, the Holocaust
occurred, while we calling this

420
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:25,920
critical race theory when this
is history.

421
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:31,720
So if you look at history books
back in the 80s and 90s and

422
00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:34,560
start looking at history books,
not even publishing companies

423
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:39,080
are facing these challenges
because they don't want to put

424
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:42,520
anything in there about slavery.
And if they put Martin Luther

425
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:46,920
King in the book, it has nothing
to do with the argument or or

426
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,440
the fight for civil rights.
The right to go through the

427
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:56,880
front door or the right to drink
out of the same water fountain

428
00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:02,960
or the right to sit in the same
area on the bus or in any public

429
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:06,320
facility.
So again, why are we calling

430
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,120
this critical race theory when
these were occurrences?

431
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:16,960
History is based on occurrence.
Why are we saying critical race

432
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:22,560
theory when we need to be saying
authentic occurrences known AKA

433
00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:28,240
history?
So we're fighting under the

434
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,640
auspices of critical race
theory.

435
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,360
What we need to be fighting
under the auspices of authentic

436
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:36,720
occurrences, teaching of
history.

437
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:42,280
So that is my whole concern
here.

438
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,720
And yeah, and I know they are
the theoretical verges of

439
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:49,320
critical race theory and, and
critical race theory has its

440
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:55,480
place because I understand what
it, what is it is to do from its

441
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:59,760
from, from its conception of,
of, of, of the term and the

442
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:02,080
conception of the courses that
were taught.

443
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,160
Like for example, at Ole Miss
here in Mississippi, the

444
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:09,280
critical race theory was taught
at Ole Miss, the first critical

445
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,680
race theory course in the state.
So why are they called what we

446
00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,200
teach our children of the
occurrences?

447
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:21,160
World War One is not taken out,
Vietnam War is not taken out.

448
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:26,120
World War 2 is not taken out.
The Revolutionary War is not

449
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:28,600
taken out.
That's authentic history

450
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:32,560
occurrences.
Why have we taken out slavery?

451
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:36,320
Why have we taken out the civil
rights movement?

452
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:38,720
To understand why have we taken
out the lynching?

453
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:42,520
It is not intended to make
anybody feel bad.

454
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:47,600
It's just teaching history.
So I'm not understanding the

455
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:51,320
term critical race theory as it
relates to the classroom.

456
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,840
Critical race theory is over
here on its own for something

457
00:32:55,840 --> 00:33:00,360
else to to dig a little deeper
to to why people might have done

458
00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:03,240
things and and using your
critical thinking.

459
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:07,880
But no, I'm talking about
teaching facts.

460
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,240
You, you don't even have to
bring in my opinion, but just

461
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:17,840
teaching facts.
So I think our approach, we're

462
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:21,880
under the wrong we're we're
we're under the wrong auspices.

463
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:25,400
We are on they're saying
critical race 0 when we need to

464
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,600
be advocating for authentic
history.

465
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,560
That's what I take on it.
So Doctor Wallace, I get.

466
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:33,960
Passionate about that.
I'm sorry, I get passionate

467
00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:36,160
about that.
And I love this passion.

468
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:40,440
And I think this is a circular
sort of position because I think

469
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:44,720
this, the idea of racist makes
people very uncomfortable.

470
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:49,080
And that's because we really
have not seriously dealt with

471
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:51,360
our racial history in this
country.

472
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:55,760
And so it still makes people.
Uncomfortable.

473
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:59,440
Uncomfortable and I and I don't
want to say both sides of the

474
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,040
aisle because I think there's
more than one aisle.

475
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:06,080
This is sort of one of those.
There are multiple aisles that

476
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:11,159
lead us down to to this point
around race and in society.

477
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:17,840
But CRT or critical race theory,
I think in many ways lends

478
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:22,120
itself for you to be able to
even ask this question about

479
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:28,880
authentic history.
Does that make sense?

480
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:32,760
Yes, yes it does.
It does again.

481
00:34:35,199 --> 00:34:39,120
I'm still wondering why we why
are we even there or when it

482
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:44,960
comes to that.
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483
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492
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506
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507
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,760
tour at add up xe.com.
I was.

508
00:36:38,900 --> 00:36:43,940
In Connecticut last year, I
visited the Mark Twain's museum

509
00:36:44,500 --> 00:36:50,500
and in I think it's symbolic.
There's a case like a bird cage

510
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,960
locked up.
And they have books that America

511
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:59,400
has poured off the shelf like
Tom Sawyer, the Adventures of

512
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:06,360
Huckleberry Finn books, even
Alice Walker's a book about

513
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:09,040
different people, different
cultures.

514
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:12,080
It's a cartoon.
It's a it's a child's book.

515
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,720
They poured it anything that
that that talked about

516
00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:19,440
differences in there.
And if you read her book, her

517
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:23,520
book has all races.
Like if she's not degraded in

518
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:26,120
any race, she was just saying
we're all different.

519
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,200
I am black, I am Hispanic, I am
white.

520
00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,480
I am I am Indian, I'm Native
American.

521
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:37,760
So it's poured off the shell.
And I heard my governor here in

522
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:41,440
Mississippi saying we don't want
our children to feel bad about

523
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:47,040
the actions of our forefathers.
OK, then take history out all

524
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:51,520
together.
Revolutionary War, you fought,

525
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:56,040
you left, you left, you left
Europe, you came to America, you

526
00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:59,080
fought the British, blood was
shed.

527
00:37:59,960 --> 00:38:03,520
But you don't want to teach the
Civil War again.

528
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:08,120
Those discrepancy, the
discrepancies appear to me

529
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:10,880
hypocrisy.
So.

530
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:18,800
So discrepancy in this case
equals hypocrisy because some

531
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:25,760
can can stay and some can't.
You get to choose what's what

532
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:31,880
does not offend certain groups
of people, certain a certain

533
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:36,880
group of persons.
Usually, again, politics are

534
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:40,520
personal, so it doesn't offend
me and my constituent group.

535
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:44,080
Right.
Not, not necessarily certain

536
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:46,320
people.
It doesn't offend me.

537
00:38:47,240 --> 00:38:51,560
It's a constituent group or
groups and.

538
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:54,480
I know where you're going.
Yes.

539
00:38:55,240 --> 00:39:04,960
So, so so again, again, my, my,
my big concern is the term.

540
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:13,000
Sometimes I think terms can
misdirect intent or, or should I

541
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:18,280
say phrases or titles or this
or, or what's your name and the

542
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:27,600
cause can can negatively impact
the actual intent.

543
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:33,000
And again, OK, for example, you
know, when I learned about Black

544
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:40,960
Wall Street, I went to Oklahoma,
Tulsa, OK to visit a friend and

545
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:46,400
this may have been 10 years ago
and saw the stature like what is

546
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:54,480
that had never I'm I'm
embarrassed to admit, but when I

547
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:59,840
thought when I found out about
it, I went and and and read

548
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:06,200
about it and I was like, wow, a
lot of.

549
00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:10,440
African Americans who made
contributions to society.

550
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:19,280
I would not have known about it
had I not been a reader or or or

551
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:22,600
or.
My mom bought a book on on

552
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,000
African American contributions
to America.

553
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:28,480
But again, that was just one
household.

554
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,000
Did not see them in my history
books.

555
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:36,720
And now if you think it scarce
back then, imagine what it looks

556
00:40:36,720 --> 00:40:42,240
like now with this critical race
theory ban, which I'm still

557
00:40:42,240 --> 00:40:48,800
trying to understand why.
Well, I guess I'm trying to.

558
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:53,960
I'm trying to make logic of it.
I understand why, but I'm just

559
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:57,720
trying to make logic.
And sometimes there's just no

560
00:40:57,720 --> 00:41:01,520
logic.
Well, all the time Grandmama

561
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:06,440
used to say there is no logic in
foolishness, point blank.

562
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:12,320
So, so I'm just trying to
understand why are we banning

563
00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:15,320
our teachers from teaching
authentic history?

564
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:19,000
So it's so bad that teachers
don't know what to teach.

565
00:41:19,720 --> 00:41:22,560
So I interviewed legislators who
were meeting with their

566
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:27,080
constituents and and teachers
were concerned because they

567
00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:30,600
don't know what a child may go
back and tell his or her mom

568
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:38,760
about the lesson for the day.
And if a parent complaints and

569
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:42,480
it becomes problematic,
districts can lose money

570
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:45,800
funding.
So teachers don't know what to

571
00:41:45,800 --> 00:41:47,480
do.
They don't know what to teach

572
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:50,160
and history teachers are
limited.

573
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:54,680
But there is there is policy out
there.

574
00:41:55,320 --> 00:42:00,520
There are laws out there that
say that say no, you cannot

575
00:42:00,520 --> 00:42:05,160
teach this in this book, To Kill
a Mockingbird was poor from the

576
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,160
shell.
Really.

577
00:42:08,240 --> 00:42:11,320
Black Boy was poor from the
shell.

578
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:19,640
I mean, it is amazing.
Anything that alluded to slavery

579
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,760
and the treatment of African
Americans during that time,

580
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:27,640
those books are banned.
Or anything that's fiction,

581
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:33,280
nonfiction.
Regardless, it's poor.

582
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:38,800
And my question is why?
Because teaching history, it's

583
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:42,520
not intended to make somebody
feel bad about what occurred

584
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:48,440
hundreds of years ago, as as one
legislature said in my in my

585
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:51,920
findings, he said.
If we don't, if people don't

586
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:54,360
know where we've been, they
don't know what to advocate for

587
00:42:54,360 --> 00:42:57,000
in the future.
And history can repeat itself

588
00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:02,280
because you never knew what to
stand a gas because it has been

589
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:07,040
banned and and eventually the
goal is that this totally fades

590
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:10,640
out.
Slavery would be something up in

591
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:14,480
cyberspace somewhere.
It won't even be in print

592
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:16,760
anywhere.
That is the goal.

593
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,480
And so the advocacy piece here
is so important.

594
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:24,840
How are we advocating for this?
So now people got to vote.

595
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,000
You got to vote and you have to
put people back in their places

596
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:32,920
that can go back into and we can
overturn these laws and policies

597
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,680
that have been set during this
era.

598
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:40,240
That's the state of education
we're in right now in America.

599
00:43:42,240 --> 00:43:45,760
And that that's where that
advocacy piece came in for me.

600
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:49,200
Because in order to leave us
there, sometimes we got to

601
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:54,000
advocate so, so, so, so so that
we're able to teach and do what

602
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:58,240
we need to do in the classroom.
I can't imagine trying to make

603
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:02,360
anybody feel bad about history
that occurred because history

604
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:06,480
means something that happened in
the past, right?

605
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:09,880
Or or something.
So, so whatever I do today,

606
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,160
tomorrow is in the past.
So history is going to keep on

607
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:14,560
making.
It's always going to be in the

608
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:18,120
past.
So, so my concern is why are we

609
00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:21,800
making it look that the subject
itself?

610
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:26,600
Why are we making it look bad to
teach what occurred and why

611
00:44:26,600 --> 00:44:30,680
don't who gets to choose what's
OK?

612
00:44:31,240 --> 00:44:35,640
That's the big question.
Who said you get to choose

613
00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:42,640
what's OK?
I I think we're going to leave

614
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:47,240
that right there because those
are powerful questions and we're

615
00:44:47,240 --> 00:44:48,840
going to let it breathe for a
minute.

616
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:56,680
So Doctor Wallace, what advice
would you give to anyone who is

617
00:44:56,680 --> 00:45:00,720
considering education as a
profession in this current

618
00:45:00,720 --> 00:45:03,840
context, as you're advocating
for leaving a stamp?

619
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:07,000
What, what advice would you give
them?

620
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:09,120
And, and I'm going to, I'm going
to open this up.

621
00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:14,160
When I say the profession, I
mean P12, but also university

622
00:45:14,160 --> 00:45:18,320
level preparation for those who
might want to pursue educator

623
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:24,640
preparation.
You know, someone asked me that

624
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:32,280
question a few weeks ago and it
has stuck with me.

625
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:38,480
And then this is just in general
conversation in this time, first

626
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:40,120
of all.
So of course, I'm just going to

627
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:47,760
reiterate the challenges,
challenges, low pay, and this is

628
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,480
based on research that I've read
that reiterate these things.

629
00:45:51,720 --> 00:46:01,680
Low pay teachers feel
unappreciated, stigmas, bands on

630
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:05,080
what can be taught and how it
can be taught, lack of

631
00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:10,480
discipline, lack of parental
engagement, lack of parental and

632
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:14,400
sometimes district and school
support from leaders.

633
00:46:16,640 --> 00:46:20,240
All of that.
And what can I tell a teacher?

634
00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:23,840
What could I tell someone who
says Doctor Wallace, I was

635
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:25,920
thinking about teaching, what do
you think?

636
00:46:28,120 --> 00:46:34,600
And my first thing that I would
have to say, ask them, do you

637
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:45,240
have a passion to make a
difference in a child's life or

638
00:46:45,240 --> 00:46:48,400
a student's life?
Because if it's higher end, do

639
00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:51,520
you have a passion to make a
difference?

640
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:59,360
Do you have a love to empower
somebody to be great?

641
00:47:02,680 --> 00:47:15,240
Do you, do you really want to
interact with students who come

642
00:47:15,240 --> 00:47:19,160
from different backgrounds,
different social, economic

643
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:24,640
statuses, different values,
beliefs, norms?

644
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:33,120
Do you really want to have to
work with this kind of

645
00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:38,320
population?
If your answer is yes, you're in

646
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:44,160
the right field.
So my advice to you is that you

647
00:47:44,160 --> 00:47:50,680
are needed and if this is your
passion and something you really

648
00:47:50,680 --> 00:47:54,920
want to do, we need you because
you aren't going to be the

649
00:47:54,920 --> 00:48:00,440
change agent that's going to
impact the world because you are

650
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:02,560
releasing students into the
world.

651
00:48:04,800 --> 00:48:14,000
The meaning, the reward comes
from your passion to serve, to

652
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:21,200
teach, to learn, to empower.
So my recommendation to you is

653
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:24,920
go in there and leave a stamp on
it.

654
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:31,320
You know, that's beautiful
because it, it, it speaking to

655
00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:34,280
me in a different way, a
different wavelength.

656
00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:37,880
So for those people who say yes,
those aspiring individuals.

657
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:41,360
Who say yes?
Then what is our role and

658
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:46,960
responsibilities as stewards
within the profession to now

659
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:51,560
support and develop them?
Very good.

660
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:57,240
So again, as we are teaching
content and that's why scenarios

661
00:48:57,240 --> 00:49:00,560
are so important.
I love using scenarios in and

662
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:03,440
when I'm teaching, I teach
leadership, I teach

663
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:05,880
multiculturalism, I teach
theories.

664
00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:12,480
We have we have scenarios that
of course are real occurrences.

665
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:17,680
I think that that's important in
our teaching and I know research

666
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:21,720
is good, but something there are
times when we are training, when

667
00:49:21,720 --> 00:49:25,760
we're teaching Doctor Isa, we
got to get real practical.

668
00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:33,080
We got to we got to come on down
to to what are some real

669
00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:37,640
scenarios that are occurring in
these schools so that students

670
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:41,640
are not shocked like I was.
I didn't have a whole lot of

671
00:49:41,640 --> 00:49:44,840
scenarios.
So let me give you an example.

672
00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:49,680
I came from a home again, this
understanding who are who you

673
00:49:49,720 --> 00:49:52,200
are.
I came from a home with a Mama

674
00:49:52,200 --> 00:49:56,440
and daddy rules.
We had books.

675
00:49:57,240 --> 00:50:00,880
Learning was in the background.
I mean, not the background was

676
00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:04,280
in the forefront.
Education was was in the

677
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:06,800
forefront.
So we're investing in you and

678
00:50:06,800 --> 00:50:09,680
your sister.
So I wanted to work.

679
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:13,760
I wanted to work my junior year.
I wanted to work a job at

680
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:15,600
McDonald's.
I went to my parents and asked

681
00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:17,080
them could I work?
They said no.

682
00:50:17,640 --> 00:50:19,360
My dad said I'll take care of
this house.

683
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:22,200
You don't need to work.
You got everything you need.

684
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:25,640
I was like, when I water work, I
have opportunity.

685
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:29,200
I can make some money and buy
some of the things I want I want

686
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:32,200
and I and so of course you get
to go to your mom.

687
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:35,200
I was able to get to my mom, my
mom talking to my dad.

688
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:43,560
They came back, they said OK,
here are the are the rules for

689
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:46,640
you to work.
Number one, you can order work

690
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:48,960
on Friday and Saturday.
You will not work on through the

691
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:53,480
week because your grades are
important and you are getting a

692
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:59,760
scholarship to college.
OK #2 You work on Friday night,

693
00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:03,360
of course, from 5:00 to 11:00
because you get out of school at

694
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:05,520
three.
You go to your great aunt's

695
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:07,280
house and you call us when you
get there.

696
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:10,040
It should take you about 30
minutes to get to her house.

697
00:51:10,240 --> 00:51:13,920
At 11:30, you, because my mom
knew the schedule, she had

698
00:51:13,920 --> 00:51:17,320
talked to the manager.
You get to your auntie's house

699
00:51:17,680 --> 00:51:20,880
and you call us Saturday you
work from 11:00 to 5:00.

700
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:24,240
At 7:00 you need to be in this
house Sunday.

701
00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:26,880
You get up and go to church
Friday and Saturday.

702
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:31,040
So my grades didn't change.
I was excited making my money.

703
00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:35,160
Here I am a teacher, student is
sleeping in my class and I'm

704
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:40,040
just a I'm just insensitive,
nervous, no real training or

705
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:42,680
scenario or social emotional
learning.

706
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:46,040
A student is sleeping and every
day I'm like, wake up, why are

707
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:48,480
you sleeping in my class?
I'm going to send you to the

708
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:51,720
principal office and I'm just
all over the place as a teacher.

709
00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:57,880
And one day I guess the student
was had enough of me and the

710
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:01,920
student says, Miss Young, I'm
going to talk to you after

711
00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:03,920
class.
And when class was over, he came

712
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:06,720
to me.
He said, Miss Young, I sleep in

713
00:52:06,720 --> 00:52:09,280
your class because I don't get
off work.

714
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:12,520
I don't get home till 1:00.
I have to get up at 5:00 to

715
00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:14,840
catch the bus.
I work.

716
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:21,360
I'm looking, I work.
And my Mama told me that if I

717
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:24,520
didn't work, I had to get my aid
out of her M Bell's house.

718
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:30,760
Now, do you know how I felt this
small?

719
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:35,040
I felt like a speck that you
couldn't see with a microscope

720
00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:40,120
because I didn't even take the
time to see what was going on

721
00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:42,280
with this student.
Because where I'm from, you

722
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:45,920
don't work your Mama and your
their prevention that surely if

723
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:49,200
your Mama allows you to work,
she's going to have some rules

724
00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:52,440
and regulations that don't
impede upon your education.

725
00:52:52,920 --> 00:52:57,680
That's everybody is like me
because that's the way it is.

726
00:52:57,680 --> 00:53:02,840
As a teacher, these are my laws
and my values and my belief and

727
00:53:02,840 --> 00:53:05,360
everybody is like it.
Well, guess what?

728
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:12,920
That kid changed my world
because you I had to go back and

729
00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:15,440
you know what I did?
I found out that was a smart

730
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:17,200
kid.
I worked with him.

731
00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:23,160
I allowed him time because he
had to lay his head somewhere.

732
00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:28,040
But but I was totally
insensitive and did not have

733
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:34,040
those scenarios to make me think
about me imposing what I my

734
00:53:34,040 --> 00:53:36,280
experiences up on these
students.

735
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:38,560
Now, of course you can get some
guidance and some

736
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:42,400
recommendations, but I was
totally imposing.

737
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:46,600
So that's why I say in
preparation, we have to have

738
00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:51,360
scenarios that are real and to
talk about these things because

739
00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:55,680
in this day and era, this day
and time, this era of learning,

740
00:53:56,480 --> 00:54:01,000
these teachers are going to face
things a lot worse than kids who

741
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:04,480
have to work in their homes.
So that that to me, that's an

742
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:08,240
important part of training.
That social emotional learning

743
00:54:08,240 --> 00:54:12,920
piece is crucial.
So I'm going to empathize with

744
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:15,480
you and hopefully that you
because I can hear that you're

745
00:54:15,480 --> 00:54:19,520
still feeling some guilt around
that first experience, which is

746
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:23,280
not warranted because you could
only operate out of the

747
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:26,160
knowledge base that you had at
the time.

748
00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:33,200
And your intentions were not
negative towards the towards the

749
00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:35,800
demise, the demise of this
particular student.

750
00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:40,240
But I'm so happy that as you
talk about, you know, advocate

751
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,440
advocacy is one of those
elements of taking a stamp,

752
00:54:43,720 --> 00:54:45,400
making a stamp or leaving a
stamp.

753
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:48,760
Your student was able to
advocate for himself having a

754
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:51,480
conversation with you.
But I also think that you

755
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:55,400
answered the question around the
critical race and authentic

756
00:54:55,400 --> 00:54:59,040
history and why we make the
rules we make because we're

757
00:54:59,040 --> 00:55:02,760
operating out of our own lived
experiences.

758
00:55:03,080 --> 00:55:07,640
So if you've never had that
experience of having your family

759
00:55:07,640 --> 00:55:11,800
sort of really restrict you from
working, and if you do work, lay

760
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:16,360
down these parameters because
you asked to work.

761
00:55:16,680 --> 00:55:19,320
It wasn't a matter of your
parents asking you to work.

762
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,480
And here's a student whose
parent is saying, if you don't

763
00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:25,120
work, you cannot stay under my
roof.

764
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:32,960
And so that's not something that
many of us would conceive of.

765
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:37,720
And so when we make rules and
policies, we're operating out of

766
00:55:37,720 --> 00:55:42,320
our own lived experiences
without having as a very top of

767
00:55:42,320 --> 00:55:45,040
the conversation.
You talked about relationship

768
00:55:45,040 --> 00:55:50,200
building, which means you have
to speak to other people outside

769
00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:55,120
of your sphere.
And that's why I think this has

770
00:55:55,120 --> 00:55:59,200
become a full circle moment.
And this interview is really

771
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:02,560
stirring up some stuff to, to
see what you're really

772
00:56:02,720 --> 00:56:06,560
reiterating to me why this work
is important.

773
00:56:07,480 --> 00:56:10,960
Thank you for this.
Thank you because you are really

774
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:14,800
you're.
You're you're you're reminding

775
00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:22,920
me why I do this.
So, Doctor Jennifer Young

776
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:28,440
Wallace, what is next for you
through your scholarship,

777
00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:31,760
through your advocacy, through
your ongoing relationship with

778
00:56:32,120 --> 00:56:35,400
ATE?
And how might the Add Up

779
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:40,480
Accelerated Excellence community
engage with your work?

780
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:47,680
Well, thank you.
So first, I am I am excited to

781
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:54,600
really get this framework for
stamp for leaders and for for

782
00:56:54,600 --> 00:56:56,520
educators.
So when I said leaders, I'm

783
00:56:56,520 --> 00:56:59,640
talking about principal
superintendents, even though

784
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:03,440
they can be similar, but there's
still some some difference on on

785
00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:06,720
what a stamp administrator could
look like and what a stamp

786
00:57:07,640 --> 00:57:10,280
educator teacher could look
like, right?

787
00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:13,120
Even I've been a school
counselor, maybe what a stamp

788
00:57:13,280 --> 00:57:15,240
counselor could look like,
right?

789
00:57:15,400 --> 00:57:19,800
Because that's a whole nother
conversation about how

790
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:24,040
counselors are not being used
for what they were trained.

791
00:57:24,720 --> 00:57:28,920
But but so, so, so, so this work
that I'm kicking off into is the

792
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:32,280
framework of stamping what that
could look like, right?

793
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:37,680
And just starting the research
on on making this, making this.

794
00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:42,120
I'm not trying to get something
that's so philosophical.

795
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:44,720
I just want something that's
ABC.

796
00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:49,880
If I want to be a stamp
educator, what how would I look

797
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:54,200
in the mirror?
OK, the AB CS of a stamp

798
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:58,320
educator and then?
Can I change it to the STAMP of

799
00:57:58,960 --> 00:58:01,160
the educator and educator
leaders?

800
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:03,920
Yes, yes, that's right.
That's right.

801
00:58:03,920 --> 00:58:05,120
That is it.
I like that.

802
00:58:05,120 --> 00:58:08,000
I like that.
And then I want, I want to, I

803
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:14,760
want to research my research.
And I have right now I have two

804
00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:19,080
error 3 errors of major
interests and and I have these

805
00:58:19,080 --> 00:58:19,720
three.
Damn.

806
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:23,720
The first one is I want to
finish the work on critical race

807
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:34,000
theory to see how this could be
maybe reworded, retitled, I

808
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:36,840
don't know.
But I need, I want to, I want to

809
00:58:37,120 --> 00:58:39,960
go on and get back into this
research.

810
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:47,600
And I also want I have, I had
begun talking to drop offs based

811
00:58:47,600 --> 00:58:50,280
on my experience as a teacher,
having those guys who have

812
00:58:50,280 --> 00:58:53,920
probationary officers that I
learned they've never graduated,

813
00:58:54,080 --> 00:58:55,920
right?
Because they need more than my

814
00:58:55,920 --> 00:59:01,520
class to pass, right?
So why what happened?

815
00:59:02,600 --> 00:59:06,520
And I know that there's research
out that is very theoretical.

816
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:09,040
I don't even want to be
theoretical in this.

817
00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:13,320
I want to sit down and have
these conversations and I want

818
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:16,200
to find out and I want to turn
these conversations into

819
00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:19,360
scenarios that could be
beneficial to teachers to

820
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:24,720
recognize a kid that I heard
somebody say at risk.

821
00:59:24,800 --> 00:59:27,400
But then I heard I read where
they said, no, you're not at

822
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:29,720
risk.
You are, you are and you are not

823
00:59:29,720 --> 00:59:32,240
a risk.
You are a possibility, right?

824
00:59:32,520 --> 00:59:37,400
So, so, but but these did this
drop out these kids that drop

825
00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:40,320
out why?
And and even white males.

826
00:59:40,600 --> 00:59:44,040
I want to I want to go to the
jail and I want to talk to these

827
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:47,160
black and white males to find
out why did they drop out of

828
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:48,200
school?
What happened?

829
00:59:48,680 --> 00:59:51,320
As I want to find out from the
right bill, why did you drop

830
00:59:51,320 --> 00:59:53,360
out?
America is was built for your

831
00:59:53,360 --> 00:59:55,640
success.
What happened?

832
00:59:55,840 --> 01:00:01,160
Maybe that can be an impact that
could be impactful for teachers

833
01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:04,840
that could also be reflected in
African Americans or when we're

834
01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:09,000
teaching African American boys.
So, so I had to go on this work

835
01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:11,320
and I'm still, I want to finish
this work.

836
01:00:11,800 --> 01:00:18,040
And lastly, academic mobbing.
And let me tell you what I mean

837
01:00:18,040 --> 01:00:20,120
by academic mobbing.
That's start on the list.

838
01:00:22,240 --> 01:00:24,400
So.
So I'm talking about my research

839
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:29,120
with my publications.
Again, that that would also lead

840
01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:31,760
lead into books.
Of course, we've talked about

841
01:00:31,760 --> 01:00:35,120
the HBCU initiative, so that
that's more of like an

842
01:00:35,120 --> 01:00:38,200
initiative Commission that
stands on its own.

843
01:00:38,200 --> 01:00:44,600
And we're that work, a lot of
this work is going to fall into

844
01:00:45,040 --> 01:00:48,040
the HBCU because there's
academic mob in there.

845
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:50,520
There is the issue with critical
race theory there.

846
01:00:50,520 --> 01:00:53,880
We have a lot of students who
drop out who come to college for

847
01:00:53,880 --> 01:00:56,800
semester drop out.
So it's all going to kind of

848
01:00:56,800 --> 01:01:01,840
overlap with the HBCU.
But academic mobbing on college

849
01:01:01,840 --> 01:01:08,160
campuses among faculty, you will
be surprised at some of the

850
01:01:08,560 --> 01:01:11,560
where you may not be surprised.
There's a difference in

851
01:01:11,560 --> 01:01:20,040
politicking and flat out
mistreatment because sometimes

852
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:22,840
they're politicking.
We don't always get the

853
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:27,600
promotion, we don't always get
the raise, we don't always get

854
01:01:27,600 --> 01:01:30,120
the recognition.
That's different.

855
01:01:31,040 --> 01:01:35,640
But I'm talking about just flat
foot targeting and, and, and,

856
01:01:35,880 --> 01:01:39,600
and to the point that your goal
is to push them out.

857
01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:44,720
So you have gone beyond the
politics and you have now become

858
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:52,080
hostile and you are literally
mobbing the, the, these people.

859
01:01:52,760 --> 01:01:57,640
So again, those are my 3 focuses
there.

860
01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:01,360
So that's the future for Doctor
Wallace at this point.

861
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:04,800
And how might folks connect with
you?

862
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:16,960
I can be reached at
jkywallacejkywallace@yahoo.com.

863
01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:22,000
I can also be reached at Jackson
State University,

864
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:31,440
jennifer.k.young@jsums.edu.
And once you make that

865
01:02:31,440 --> 01:02:35,440
connection with me, I will get
back with you.

866
01:02:35,720 --> 01:02:38,280
My website.
Right now, again, as we're

867
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:44,160
building this framework, I have
someone not working on my logo

868
01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:57,760
and also working on my social
media as well as my e-mail

869
01:03:00,280 --> 01:03:05,080
address URL.
So right now I'm using JKY and

870
01:03:05,080 --> 01:03:10,360
jennifer.k.young@gsums.edu.
But there are some things that

871
01:03:10,360 --> 01:03:13,280
are in the work that are, that
are literally probably at work

872
01:03:13,280 --> 01:03:18,200
as we are speaking.
Tina, Doctor Wallace, I believe

873
01:03:18,200 --> 01:03:22,160
you're also on LinkedIn.
Oh yes, Oh yes, I'm on LinkedIn

874
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:25,560
and Facebook.
Jennifer Young Wallace, I am on

875
01:03:25,560 --> 01:03:28,640
LinkedIn.
Please feel free to contact me

876
01:03:28,640 --> 01:03:30,600
there.
And even when I get this other

877
01:03:30,600 --> 01:03:35,200
stuff completed and my goal is
may to have all of that done,

878
01:03:36,360 --> 01:03:39,240
I'm still going to stay on
Facebook and I'm going to stay

879
01:03:39,240 --> 01:03:43,360
on LinkedIn and looking forward
to Instagram.

880
01:03:44,760 --> 01:03:48,280
So Doctor Jennifer Young
Wallace, thank you for this

881
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:52,400
opportunity to learn with and
from you here at Add Up

882
01:03:52,440 --> 01:03:56,320
Accelerated Excellence, where we
seek to advance education of

883
01:03:56,320 --> 01:03:59,800
excellence and equity.
Thank you.

884
01:03:59,920 --> 01:04:04,960
This has been a an honor, an
opportunity and a true

885
01:04:05,160 --> 01:04:06,640
privilege.
Thank you.

886
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:10,880
Thank you for engaging with Ed
Up Accelerated Excellence, a

887
01:04:10,880 --> 01:04:14,840
member of the Ed Up Experience
network of educational podcasts.

888
01:04:14,840 --> 01:04:18,160
Join us and we encourage you to
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889
01:04:18,160 --> 01:04:21,520
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890
01:04:21,720 --> 01:04:25,720
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891
01:04:25,840 --> 01:04:28,760
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892
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:33,320
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893
01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:35,280
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894
01:04:35,280 --> 01:04:38,720
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895
01:04:38,720 --> 01:04:41,440
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01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:45,840
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897
01:04:46,120 --> 01:04:49,600
A special thanks to our research
assistant, Emma Worthington, a

898
01:04:49,600 --> 01:04:52,640
PhD student of Fordham
University School Psychology

899
01:04:52,640 --> 01:04:54,600
Program, and we want to hear
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900
01:04:54,920 --> 01:04:58,240
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901
01:04:58,240 --> 01:05:03,080
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902
01:05:03,080 --> 01:05:05,200
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903
01:05:05,400 --> 01:05:07,440
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