Dr. Terrance McNeil—Elevating the work of HBCU Teacher Preparation with the AACTE HBCU TAG

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Conversation is obviously, you
know, someone talking you right

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and and got you to the space.
I think we need a reimagined

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discussion about the critical
need for education in our

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communities.
The reality is no one's coming

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to save us, right?
And we have to do this in many

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of our communities for
ourselves, which means

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cultivating a more educated
secondary, you know, school

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environment, even down to in our
early childhood.

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We have to cultivate education
intentionally and, and, and you

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know, teachers of the future and
school leaders of the future

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really need to see their space
in community building.

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After all, it is teachers who
train all the other fields,

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right?
So from engineering to medicine

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and all the other spaces, it
can't be done without quality

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teaching.
And so I just feel like there's

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a conversation that needs to
happen in our communities and

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amongst our young people to
where they really see their role

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in transforming our communities
and and changing the world that

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we live in in a positive manner
by embracing the call to become

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educators.
I think if we can reimagine that

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discussion because we have a
young

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this is Doctor Rosa Rivera
McCutcheon, author of Radical

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Care, Leading for Justice in
Urban Schools, and you're

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listening to Add Up Accelerated
Excellence.

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Thank you for tuning in to Add
Up Accelerated Excellence, the

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podcast for the advancement of
educational excellence and

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equity.
And we would like to share 2

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wonderful opportunities, 4
educators, policymakers,

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advocates, and scholars to
engage in community. 1st is with

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our Ed Up Accelerated Excellence
listening tour because we

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fundamentally believe that by
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the engine of transformation,
unlocking the hidden insights

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that spark meaningful change.
This week, listen to a voice

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that you often don't hear from
to seek out new insights about

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educational excellence or
equity, and share your thoughts

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via voicemail at Add Up xe.com.
That's Add Up xe.com, and your

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thoughts may be shared on air
throughthispodcastthatsthexelisteningtour@edupxe.com.

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In addition, Deans, directors,
and faculty of educator

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preparation programs, we invite
you to submit nominations for

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Outstanding Future Teachers for
the Accelerated Excellence

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Future Teacher Award.
Research informs us that

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teaching is one of the most
rewarding professions and one

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upon which all others are
dependent.

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So help us in elevating educator
preparation by nominating an

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outstanding future teacher for
the Accelerated Excellence

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Future Teacher Award. 2020 Five
2026.

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Find more details in the show
notes.

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notes.
Welcome, welcome, welcome to Add

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Up Accelerated Excellence, the
podcast for the advancement of

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educational excellence and
equity.

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And I'm your host, Jacob Easley,
the second PHDPMP.

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And this is the first episode of
a new series focusing on

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excellence, equity and evolution
of historically backed colleges

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and universities.
And we're going to kick this off

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with actually someone I've known
for a while.

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This gentleman is amazing.
I have to say he's amazing.

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So he's a champion for HBC US.
He is a champion for educated

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preparation.
And we both know each other

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through our work and connections
with the American Association of

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Colleges for Teacher Education.
He is Doctor Terence McNeil,

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chair of the A A/C TEHBCU
Topical Action Group or better

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known as A tag, and he is also
the associate professor in the

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Department of Educational
Practice and Leadership at

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Tennessee State University.
So Terrence, would you introduce

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yourself to the add up
Accelerated Excellence community

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by giving voice to Your Name is
Only You can and just tell us

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what's top of mind right now as
you continue your work as a

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giant in the world of HBCU
action.

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Well, I'll do that, but first I
just want to say thank you

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brother, for the kind words as
well As for the existence of

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this podcast and the work that
you're doing to amplify the

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voices within the higher Ed
space and, and especially with

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this series that allows us to
center the work of HBCU.

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So yes, I am Terrence McNeil,
Associate Professor at TSU, as

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the brother said, and I am
really happy to be here.

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I I come to you by way of
Tennessee State University, but

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also through Florida A&M
University where I'm a proud two

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time rattler, and also by way of
Fayetteville, NC, where I've got

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my first taste of the HBCU
experience.

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Before I knew what an HBCU was,
I knew what Fayetteville State

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University was and so learned a
great deal.

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I think that imprinted me on me
well, but I'm here and I'm

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really happy to have had a
number of of experiences coming

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through the ranks of, you know,
getting my education and

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applying that education,
hopefully for the upliftment of

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not just HBCUS, but education in
teacher education and school

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leadership in general.
So really happy to be here.

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I'm looking forward to having
this discussion with you, Sir.

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Well, welcome, welcome, welcome
to the show.

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So we're going to go back a bit
and then work our way forward,

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if you don't mind.
So I know you began your career

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in education as a classroom
teacher, so I'm thinking about

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that.
And you've had advanced

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experiences working with and
studying at HBC US.

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But how did that classroom like
K12 experience shape your

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affinity for annual work within
HBC US today?

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Well, I tell you, you know, I, I
did start my, my career, you

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know, working in K12 education.
I was a certified teacher in

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social studies 6 through 12.
I spent a lot of time working

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with students on all levels,
really even the primary level.

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You know, one time I was at a
school and two things happened.

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They really imprinted on me.
One time I was out of school and

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I caught a kid.
You know, it's kind of speaking

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out of pocket, you know, in in
in the parking lot.

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I had a word with them.
And, you know, he's, he says to

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me, yeah, You know, Mr. Manuel,
you know, we just we just N

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words, right?
You know, that's just, that's

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just who we are, man.
We're just going to do, you

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know, do what we're doing and
things of that nature, right.

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So there was that.
And then actually prior to that,

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I had a deep conversation with
the student.

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I was working in a youth youth
detention center, doing some

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volunteer teaching there,
incarcerated young people.

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And one day they were just kind
of really, this is before I

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decided to be a teacher.
They were really kind of

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lethargic.
One day, they probably had a bad

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night.
I come in trying to, you know,

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lift spirits and things.
And they say, look, man, look at

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us.
We're here.

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We're locked up.
We're incarcerated.

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Nobody cares about us for what
our future is to be.

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And I thought about that, man.
At the time I was working for

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IBM and before I got an
education.

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And, you know, I thought about
that and, you know, I just had a

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profound impact that if any
change was going to happen in

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education, you know, I needed to
be a part of that.

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I thought it was more important
for me to pursue a career in

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education.
And at that point, having heard

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those young young people's
testimonies than than other

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pursuits that I was that I was
at the time interested in.

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So, so those, those, those,
those experiences with students

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really kind of led me to to, you
know, try to be as strong a

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voice as possible as it, as it
relates to educate the education

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of our youth.
Well I know from the first

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example the N word that was a a
black male or individual.

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I'm assuming the other groups
were as well.

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Yeah, these were incarcerated,
mostly black young men and very

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bleak outlook on what their
lives could be.

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And I, I just knew better coming
from my circumstance, what was

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possible.
I, I just realized that there

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were not enough voices to to
speak that to, to these young

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folks.
And and so, yeah, that that that

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really had a profound impact on
me.

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It changed.
It changed my whole life

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trajectory.
Just that that conversation with

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that young man.
Yeah, it was very clear that

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they had internalized societal
or low expectations of society,

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or the at least the groups for
of which they were familiar.

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Yeah.
And if you think about it, you

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know just how that happens
exponentially, right?

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There are communities all
around, you know, our nation

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where young people are, they
might not tell you that, but but

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showing signs of being destitute
of of a whole, you know, a plan

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for the future and, and, and and
that that void can be filled

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with a little bit of inspiration
from educators like like us.

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Destitute of hope.
Powerful words.

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So just briefly, when you think
about those young men, why are

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HBC US important?
Well, I tell you, you know,

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again, growing up in
Fayetteville, NC, having family

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who were, you know, situated
around the University of

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Fayetteville State, you know, I
came to know most of the

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successful people that I knew in
that town were associated with

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Fayetteville State University,
who, So they either work there

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or have been educated there.
They were supporters of it.

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There was a certain love and a
camaraderie.

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You know, it's been widely
reported, you know, the benefits

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of the HPC experience for young
black males and females.

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Having an environment that is
not just the institution of

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learning, but also one that
cares and that shows the sort of

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empathy and can't connect with
students lived experiences to

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the point to inspire them to to
do great things and work.

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You know, as a relates to our
teacher Ed experience, obviously

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the numbers don't lie in terms
of HBC, us being just 3% of the,

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the schools, the universities,
yet producing over 50% of the

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black teachers in America for,
you know, obviously punching

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above our weight in terms of
what we're able to produce.

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And so I see it as as some of
the most fertile ground for

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cultivating teachers and school
leadership, you know?

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So in your case, proximity
definitely mattered.

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Oh, absolutely, absolutely.
I just learned from from just

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being in those spaces and I was
continued, I continued to be

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affirmed in the the value of the
HBCU experience as I grew up.

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Obviously, you know, well, I
grew up years ago and the era of

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obviously and the years, the era
of, you know, school days and,

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you know, different world and
Cosby Show and all those things.

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And we will continue.
We continue to be, you know,

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kind of educated about HBC us
during that time, there was a

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lot of a lot of our
understanding and thinking was

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that the HBCU was the path to
success for us.

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Yeah.
So let's talk about the ATTHBCU

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tag on Topical Action Group.
It was founded in.

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It was founded in 2015.
So can you paint a picture for

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us of the conversations and
contexts that lead to the

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inception of this tag?
Yes, of course.

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So, you know, as you mentioned
earlier, a ACTE in the Home

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scholars organization was
fundamental to, to me as a

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young, as a PhD student.
And we were at that time under

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the administration of Sharon
Robinson, who was very

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supportive of the Home Scholar
program and encouraged us and,

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and, and, and put us in spaces,
you know, so that we can be

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educated and, and be prepared
for the, for the, the, the

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workforce in education.
We also had vice president at

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the time, Roger Lucero, who
served under that

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administration.
And seeing the work that we did

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in the Home Scholar group, I
believe it was Rod who saw us as

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an emerging voice, right.
The HBCUS were starting to

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increase his participation in
homes.

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And as I neared, you know,
graduation, you know, you know,

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he, he approached me with the
idea and the concept of having

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an affinity group for HBCU
teacher education.

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So, you know, shout out to Rod
and Sero for recognizing that

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and seeing the the value and
efficacy of the HBCU voice.

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Yeah, Rod, Rod, Rod's definitely
a change maker.

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We appreciate him and Doctor
Robinson as well.

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Yes.
The TAG recently responded to

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00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:01,520
the UNCF for the United Negro
College Fund report on Black

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00:16:01,880 --> 00:16:06,680
teacher preparation at HBC US.
So as you mentioned earlier, HBC

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00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:11,440
US produce over 1/2 of all Black
teachers within the nation.

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What would you say we can learn
from the legacy of HBCU teacher

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00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:21,680
preparation for the field more
broadly?

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00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:26,480
Yeah, we need only to look at,
you know, the history of

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excellence that has been spawned
from the HBCU experience.

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00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:36,120
So we start thinking about, you
know, people like WB Dubois and

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you know, I need S Prosser right
The first black recipient of a

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00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:45,240
of a PhD in psychology, I
believe from Prairie Review ANM

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00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:49,320
right Agnes Coppin and the
foundational people who who had

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as a mission to advance you
know, HBC US in general, but

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00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:57,040
knowing that it was
indispensable from preparing

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teachers.
Most HBC US were founded on the

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00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:04,480
principles of teacher education.
Many accreditations are tied

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00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,480
into teacher education at HBC
US.

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00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:11,720
Yeah.
So that is so that legacy of

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00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:14,599
teacher preparation and the
sheer results that we've been

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00:17:14,599 --> 00:17:16,920
able to achieve as it has been
special.

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00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:22,000
You know, I think in talking
about, you know, the legacy is

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obviously there were times when
in this society, HBC US were the

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only source for producing
teachers.

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00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:34,160
And so there's a rich history
and understanding of how

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00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:39,080
learning takes place and could
take place within spaces,

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00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:43,160
particularly marginalized
spaces, those with Black and

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00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:45,640
brown students.
I think there's a certain level

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00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:50,320
of excellence that is there as
it relates to the, the teacher

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00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:55,200
preparation that takes place.
I think it's also important to

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understand that, you know, the,
the, the, the seriousness of the

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00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:04,640
moment, right?
And the times that we find

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ourselves in here, years after
the establishment of HBC US,

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00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:16,680
years after all that has taken
place within the fight for civil

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00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:20,640
rights and, you know, within,
you know, all of the progress

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00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:24,320
that has even happened, I'll say
we still have a situation of

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00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:28,400
disparity as it relates to
academic achievement of young

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00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:31,640
people in our communities.
And so, you know, while learning

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00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:34,240
from that legacy is also
important for us to understand

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00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:37,720
what's happening right now and
the urgent need right now for

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HBC US to be motivated to to, to
do greater works to continue to

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00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:47,560
try to combat some of the
disparities that we've seen.

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00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:53,880
And just for the audience's
reference, that report is

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00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:59,760
entitled The Hard Work of Hard
Work, Black Teacher Pipeline

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00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:04,640
Best Practices at HBCU Teacher
Education Programs.

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00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,400
Yeah, No, no, no.
What I'll say about that is

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00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:10,920
another thing, you know, as it
relates to UNCF and the work

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00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:14,920
that they've done to center that
conversation.

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00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:19,440
They, you know, the HBCU tag
decided to develop a position

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00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:23,800
paper in support of that because
we really recognize the need for

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00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:28,080
us to work collectively, right,
to, to with a common message and

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to, to share.
And so when organizations like

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00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:35,120
UNCF, Step to the Plate and
Center Teacher Education, we, we

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00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:38,160
simply had to applaud that and
we had to support that because

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00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:42,760
we truly believe that not just
in terms of HBCUS or in terms of

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the Black community, the
preparation of Black teachers is

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00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:49,160
essential and valuable the
nation over.

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00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:55,440
I've said it before, I think
more folks should be educated by

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00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,480
a Black teacher, right?
And not just those from the

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00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,720
Black community.
I think it leads to a shared

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00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:05,400
understanding, a recalibration
of our perspective, you know,

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00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,680
regarding race in this country,
regarding excellence.

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00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:14,400
I think everyone needs to be
under the tutelage of at least

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00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,560
one Black teacher who cares,
right?

286
00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:21,920
And so when UNCF recognizes that
we need to focus on that

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00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:27,160
pipeline, it's it's extremely.
It's extremely heartfelt on this

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00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:29,760
side and so the tag really
supports what they've done

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00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:31,520
right.
Right.

290
00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:34,320
And I mean, we've all heard the
research that having at least

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00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:41,720
one Black teacher changes the
academic trajectory and academic

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00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:45,920
aspirations and outcomes for
students, particularly students

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00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:48,080
of color, but not only for
students of color.

294
00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:52,240
We've also seen positive impacts
with having Black teachers of

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00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,360
color, particularly you have
multiple in the school around

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00:20:55,360 --> 00:20:58,280
school culture transformation as
well.

297
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:00,280
Yeah.
And you know, that gets to your

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00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:04,600
equity conversation and one of
jump ahead of of that.

299
00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:11,360
But obviously, you know, despite
the reports, diversity is good,

300
00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:15,880
diversity of thought, diversity
of perspectives leads everyone's

301
00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:20,080
at least everyone's expanded
understanding about things, not

302
00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:22,280
just in subject matter, but in
terms of the world.

303
00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:24,200
So.
You know, it's really

304
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:25,560
interesting.
I mean, it's actually

305
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:30,000
inevitable.
Unavoidable because we all grew

306
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,040
up with different life
experiences and different

307
00:21:34,360 --> 00:21:39,000
cultural perspectives, some
macro, but micro.

308
00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:41,160
I'm going to say micro cultural
perspectives.

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00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:44,120
So for example, you grew up in
one state, I grew up in another

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00:21:44,120 --> 00:21:47,880
state to black men.
But we have different

311
00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:50,800
experiences.
And you hold to those values of

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00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:54,840
your community because those are
the ones that have supported you

313
00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:57,680
and prepared you to be
successful, at least in that

314
00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:01,600
community.
And you don't shed those those

315
00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:05,840
thoughts and beliefs
instantaneously when you are now

316
00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:09,120
in a new environment.
It takes some negotiations

317
00:22:09,120 --> 00:22:13,600
because your perspectives may
not necessarily completely work

318
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,920
in a new environment.
And so you do have to have

319
00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:20,880
conversations around diversity
in that regard.

320
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:23,000
Yeah.
Absolutely.

321
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:25,920
And, and you know, the beauty of
it is the, the black teachers

322
00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:31,040
that I have been associated with
or, or even the, the teachers

323
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,800
from HBC us, I'll say that
because we have, we have a

324
00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,040
diverse student body at
Tennessee State University full

325
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:41,520
of students from all backgrounds
who are contributing to

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00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:46,760
education.
But so I'll say the, the, you

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00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:50,640
know, from the HBCU teacher
education space, I think those

328
00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,360
students who are graduating from
those programs really want to

329
00:22:53,360 --> 00:22:55,960
contribute to critical
discussions.

330
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,160
They would, they, would they
want to be a part of the change

331
00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:01,640
that takes place.
And there's that, that empathy

332
00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:04,840
that we spoke about.
They carry that empathy into the

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00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:08,040
classroom.
And so just in a microcosmic

334
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,120
way, you know, the graduates
from HBCU teacher education

335
00:23:11,120 --> 00:23:14,320
programs are known for
contributing greatly to the

336
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:17,200
overall well-being and health of
students from all backgrounds.

337
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:23,960
That definitely makes sense.
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notes.

346
00:24:09,120 --> 00:24:15,000
So you're on record for having
highlighted or for highlighting

347
00:24:16,120 --> 00:24:20,000
the need to strengthen the black
teacher pipeline beginning prior

348
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:24,800
to college.
So what should P12 schools,

349
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:27,720
families and communities?
What should they be doing

350
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:31,160
differently if well teacher
black teacher pipeline?

351
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:33,560
Oh, of course.
That's a great question.

352
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,360
I love that question.
First of all, when we, when we

353
00:24:36,360 --> 00:24:40,360
talk about what should P12
families and schools be doing, I

354
00:24:40,360 --> 00:24:45,280
think it's it's time for us to
have a discussion about, you

355
00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:51,720
know, this K, you know, K16
right, discussion right on

356
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:56,920
because, you know, obviously
there are, you know, challenges

357
00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,520
and teacher, you know,
preparation and we, we have some

358
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:04,280
issues to discuss, but I think
it all links up to a shared

359
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:07,200
community conversation.
So I think the, the universities

360
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:08,480
have to be a part of that
discussion.

361
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:11,680
But what I will say is when I
talk to young people about

362
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:16,440
careers in education, they say
two things, which I wouldn't put

363
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,840
you on the spot, but I'm sure
you have heard these two things

364
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:22,840
as well.
One, that, you know, they don't

365
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:27,960
see a career in education
because of, you know, teacher

366
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,640
pay, right?
They say, I don't want, you

367
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,680
know, I need to get paid.
And the reality is a student

368
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:39,360
with academic promise often
elects to go for more lucrative

369
00:25:39,360 --> 00:25:42,880
fields, right on those where
they might be able to, you know,

370
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:46,640
command a higher, higher salary.
No, Now, you know, we've done

371
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:50,040
the research on that too, and
kind of debunk some of that

372
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,000
because in many cases, the
starting teacher pay is

373
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:55,880
commensurate with many other
fields.

374
00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:59,360
But there's that.
And then the other thing is they

375
00:25:59,360 --> 00:26:05,200
say, well, you know, I, I don't
want to how to say this, teach

376
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:08,480
those bad kids, right?
I, I don't want to be a part of

377
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:09,840
that.
I couldn't handle it.

378
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,920
It's just too much.
And you know, you know, my

379
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,520
conversation is obviously, you
know, someone talking you right

380
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:19,400
and, and got you to the space.
I think we need a reimagined

381
00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:23,920
discussion about the critical
need for education in our

382
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:26,240
communities.
The reality is no one's coming

383
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:29,040
to save us, right?
And we have to do this in many

384
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:30,760
of our communities for
ourselves, which means

385
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:35,520
cultivating a more educated
secondary, you know, school

386
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,840
environment, even down to, you
know, early childhood.

387
00:26:39,120 --> 00:26:41,520
We have to cultivate education
intentionally.

388
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:45,240
And, and, and, you know,
teachers of the future and

389
00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,880
school leaders of the future
really need to see their space

390
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:52,400
in community building.
After all, it is teachers who

391
00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:54,520
train all the other fields,
right?

392
00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:57,680
So from engineering to medicine
and all the other spaces, it

393
00:26:57,680 --> 00:26:59,840
can't be done without quality
teaching.

394
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,800
And so I just feel like there's
a conversation that needs to

395
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:06,080
happen in our communities and
amongst our young people to

396
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:10,800
where they really see their role
in transforming our communities

397
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:14,600
and, and changing the world that
we live in, in a positive manner

398
00:27:15,120 --> 00:27:17,960
by embracing the call to become
educators.

399
00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:22,360
I think if we can reimagine that
discussion because we have a

400
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:27,440
young generation who's growing
up in this particular

401
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:33,480
environment, you know, you know,
trying to figure out how to make

402
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:37,720
change, trying to figure out how
to be, how to make this a better

403
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:40,120
world.
And, and to, to counteract some

404
00:27:40,120 --> 00:27:43,400
of the things that are
negatively occurring in our, in

405
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,000
our community.
I think they need to understand

406
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,600
that education and educating our
young people is an extremely

407
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:54,600
indispensable piece of that.
And if they would reimagine that

408
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,480
discussion in that way, I think
we might see, you know, an

409
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:00,520
upward trend and those who are
willing to to become educators.

410
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,960
Lastly, I'll say we also need to
think about embracing students

411
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:10,800
who may not believe that they
are college material, right and

412
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:15,040
and grooming and more students.
And there was a Brown University

413
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:20,800
of report out of, of Annenberg,
I believe Brown that spoke to

414
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:24,680
the fact that we have a
disproportionately low amount of

415
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,480
black teachers compared to the
amount of students in the in

416
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:30,840
black students in public
education simply because we

417
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:33,800
don't put enough black students
in college.

418
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:39,040
And so, you know, we need to
figure out ways to recruit more

419
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:41,200
and to get more black students
in college.

420
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,560
And, and I think that would also
kind of drive up some of our

421
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:48,560
numbers in teacher education.
Two points on that just to

422
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,960
respond to you.
The low number happens to be

423
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:56,960
connected to the fact that in
most states you are expected to

424
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:02,920
have a college degree or
prepared in a way that leads

425
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,040
itself to a college degree.
So the college degree and

426
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,920
certification come together,
although some of that's

427
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:14,440
changing.
There's some new pipeline

428
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,080
initiatives that may not require
a college degree anymore.

429
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,480
But you know, that's interesting
because when we've had that

430
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:27,800
conversation about removing some
of the criteria, particularly

431
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,360
whether you have a need to have
a bachelor's degree or in New

432
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,400
York, you're required to have a
master's degree for professional

433
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,320
certification.
And So what we've realized is

434
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:42,360
that that conversation really is
to in some ways to stave off the

435
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:46,920
teacher shortage, but only for
low income, high need schools in

436
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:51,760
some ways because we find that
the more resource schools will

437
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:56,880
continue to hire folks that have
advanced credentials.

438
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,840
That's right.
The second part to that is the

439
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:07,120
research you mentioned.
We know that one expert that

440
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,040
researches that people still
value education.

441
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:13,640
They feel that education is
valuable even though they may

442
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:17,520
not find it one of the most
attractive professions.

443
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:19,960
So I think you're right in that
conversation.

444
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:25,120
How do we marry this idea of why
the folks not perceived as being

445
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:27,240
attractive?
What are those conditions

446
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,040
alongside this idea that we
actually value?

447
00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:34,720
Folks are out here advocating
that college is not important,

448
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,480
but they are college graduates.
They're sending their students,

449
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:39,400
they're sending their own
children to college.

450
00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,120
I'm not saying everyone has to
go to college or the same type

451
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:45,880
of college, but those are
contradictions where we profess

452
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:51,080
one thing but yet have a a
different value around the same

453
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,800
topic in in a different regard.
So.

454
00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:58,360
And, you know, and just to that
on the reality is that we've

455
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:02,120
seen the evidence of, you know,
the fruits of the labour, you

456
00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:06,240
know, going to college just in
our generation alone, we are

457
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:09,040
much more educated generation
than our parents.

458
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:13,360
And we are we are realizing, you
know, the effects of all of

459
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:15,440
that.
And so the evidence is very

460
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:17,120
clear on that.
I mean, obviously there are

461
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:21,120
other pathways and and things of
that nature, but we know that

462
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:25,080
success exists through the
college pathway for sure.

463
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:29,720
I definitely agree with you.
So your background that is

464
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:33,880
Tennessee State, correct?
So you're professor there and

465
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:39,480
congratulations in 2026.
This year, Tennessee State was

466
00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:41,960
ranked as one of the top HBC US
by U.S.

467
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:45,680
News and World Report.
From your vantage point, what

468
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:50,880
makes Tennessee State a special
place and a standout within

469
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,800
higher education?
Well, great question here.

470
00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:59,680
So, you know, first I'm, I'm
just really thrilled to be an

471
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,320
educator at Tennessee State
University.

472
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:06,600
A university has a storied
history of excellence.

473
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:11,240
The the track record is, is is
long and vast, right, In terms

474
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:13,320
of all the great things that
have happened here.

475
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:20,040
I think being situated in
Nashville, which is in an

476
00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:26,560
amazing city that has not just a
a music history, right as as as

477
00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:29,960
started by the 5th Jubilee
Singers, but not just an amazing

478
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:36,480
music history, but also one of a
long legacy of of civil rights

479
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,920
advocacy.
There are four HBC US in

480
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:45,560
Nashville, and I think all of
them have, you know, worked to

481
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:53,280
against each other in a positive
way, to be a city in an area

482
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:55,760
where, you know, excellence
emerges, right?

483
00:32:55,760 --> 00:33:04,080
Academic excellence emerges.
Tennessee State has at many

484
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:08,920
points led the state in teacher
and principal production.

485
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:13,720
We recently executed a grant
with the Tennessee Department of

486
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:18,800
Education that helped us to
produce a large number leading

487
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,800
the state in principal
production since I've been here.

488
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,320
We also before I arrived,
Tennessee State was a #1

489
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:32,640
producer of educators amongst
HBC us and so I was always drawn

490
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:37,000
to to to go where the work is
being done, where people are

491
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:39,880
serious about education.
We have a number of great

492
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:48,880
partnerships in this area being,
you know, the public land grant,

493
00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:53,960
state sponsored school here
positions us to have good

494
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:59,240
relationships with the state.
We did experience some turmoil

495
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,720
in in, in in previous years,
some people may know about, but

496
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:07,640
all of that has LED to us really
recommitting ourselves and

497
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,960
dedicating ourselves to doing
great work here at Tennessee

498
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:14,840
State.
So I'm, I'm pleased to, to, to

499
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:18,520
represent the university in the
education space along with my

500
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:22,960
colleagues, colleagues in
education and practice and

501
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:28,120
leadership department.
We have individuals who are

502
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,639
doing great things in, in, in
terms of Fulbright fellowships

503
00:34:32,639 --> 00:34:37,360
and our, our professors speak at
Oxford and we work with Stanford

504
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,840
University.
We've done a number of great

505
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,040
things throughout the HBC
communities.

506
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:45,840
We're a leader in education
technology, having established

507
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:50,520
the Tennessee State University
Smart Center, a great place

508
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:54,520
where a lot of great leadership
throughout HBC US is occurring

509
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:58,280
under the leadership of Doctor
Robbie Melton, who also

510
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:03,480
established the Tennessee State
University Smart Center in

511
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:07,040
Accra, Ghana as well.
So we're doing international

512
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:10,120
outreach.
We're reaching across, you know,

513
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:16,000
the water to our sister
institutions in Africa, helping

514
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:19,720
to provide leadership and
learning in that space as well.

515
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:23,720
So just so many things I could
continue to go on and on talking

516
00:35:23,720 --> 00:35:28,240
about with Tennessee State, you
know, but you know, suffice it

517
00:35:28,240 --> 00:35:32,920
to say, just as others, other
institutions, other HBCUS are

518
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:35,600
doing great things in their
region, you know, such as our

519
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,360
friends at Norfolk State
University, those in the AU

520
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:42,640
Center and down in Florida,
Florida A&M and Jackson State,

521
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:46,240
you know, they're all of these
pockets where this sort of

522
00:35:46,240 --> 00:35:49,640
excellence is, is taking place.
And so we're pleased to do the

523
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:52,560
work.
Well, you did say you can go on

524
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:55,760
talking and I do have another
question about Tennessee State.

525
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:59,880
So you also coordinate the
Higher Education Leadership EDD

526
00:35:59,920 --> 00:36:03,600
program.
What is the transformation of

527
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:08,840
value that the program seeks?
Well, I mean, you need only look

528
00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:12,040
to, I don't want to date
ourselves here on the broadcast,

529
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:17,360
but you need only look to recent
events to to see the changes

530
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:20,600
that are taking place in higher
Ed and higher education policy.

531
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:26,560
These things are affecting the
universities in a very real way.

532
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:33,440
We are very attuned to that and
we're doing our best to prepare

533
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:39,200
leaders who are capable of, of,
of working through these

534
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:43,160
challenges and, and, and keeping
the important things important.

535
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,760
We also rely upon great
relationships with some of our

536
00:36:46,760 --> 00:36:51,600
graduates who are working in
state legislature to help us to

537
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:56,760
get a better glimpse of what's
happening in education policy.

538
00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:00,200
We have a good relationship with
the Black Legislative Leaders

539
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:05,360
Network, a national consortium
of state legislators, and we're

540
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:09,040
always trying to inform our
students as to what is happening

541
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,120
right.
So our, our practicums and, and

542
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:14,600
things that we do, our
dissertations that we produce

543
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:20,240
are all geared towards helping
to create a better environment,

544
00:37:20,240 --> 00:37:23,480
a better space for students.
And we're trying to do that in

545
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:28,480
the realms of, of, of pedagogy,
of curriculum and teaching and

546
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:31,480
the areas of school leadership
and education policy.

547
00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:36,880
So would you say that in
preparing your students, is the

548
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:43,800
focus logic on the HBCU context
or centered HBCU context but

549
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,480
preparation for higher education
in general?

550
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:48,560
Yeah, you know, it's
interesting.

551
00:37:48,600 --> 00:37:52,640
I, I, I'll share a insight that
I, I received as a home scholar

552
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,480
and many of those whom I've had
this discussion with.

553
00:37:56,480 --> 00:38:01,400
No, I've said this before.
So home scholars brings together

554
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:06,240
a lot of students from all types
of, of institutions, right.

555
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:12,240
What I found when we showed up
during my time, you know, as a

556
00:38:12,240 --> 00:38:20,120
student, we were, we were taking
on a number of critical

557
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,760
discussions regarding school
leadership and teaching and

558
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:29,080
pedagogy, right?
It was our PWI colleagues who

559
00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:35,280
tended to take on more topics
related to marginalization, more

560
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,400
topics related to, you know,
microaggression and, you know,

561
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,000
things of that nature.
You know, Tennessee State has a

562
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:46,800
history of preparing good
educators with the backdrop of

563
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:52,720
us being in an HBCU, which I'm
sure provides an additional

564
00:38:52,720 --> 00:38:55,320
layer, right?
I think it makes us a little bit

565
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:59,560
more special for those looking
to pursue a doctorate because

566
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:03,400
not only do you get that
straight ahead knowledge that is

567
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:07,120
essential for you to do the work
in whatever environment and from

568
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:08,880
whatever background you've come
from.

569
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:11,680
If you happen to have a
particular interest in the

570
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:16,320
marginalized communities, then
you'll find that that TSU does a

571
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:19,200
great job of contextualizing
that conversation as well.

572
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:24,760
So we're going to continue on
the Homes work.

573
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:28,760
And I want folks to know that
Homes is a program starting in

574
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,840
the 90, I'm sorry, in the 80s,
actually the Holmes Group, then

575
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:35,520
it became the Holmes
Partnership, which both

576
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:40,120
dissolved.
And one aspect of that work was

577
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:44,880
to increase the number of
underrepresented individuals

578
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:47,560
seeking careers, particularly in
higher education.

579
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:52,480
And a ACTE took up the mantle to
preserve the Holmes Scholars

580
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:55,000
program, which came out of the
Holmes Group.

581
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:57,680
And so that's what the Scholars
program is, therefore.

582
00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:03,200
So you did mention that you were
a home scholar at FAMU.

583
00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:07,720
Well, Florida A&M, which we've
referred to as FAMU.

584
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:11,000
So how has your homes program
work?

585
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:15,280
Starting even at FAMU shaped
leadership for you, particularly

586
00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:19,880
within the ACT because now you
are the chair of the HBCU tag,

587
00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:22,640
but then leadership within the
profession at large.

588
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:27,160
So how has your you being a
recipient and participant of the

589
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,040
Home Scholars shaped your
leadership?

590
00:40:29,720 --> 00:40:31,560
Oh, yeah, thank.
Thanks for that question, Doc.

591
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:37,720
You know, so one of my
professors, Dr. Sheila Moore,

592
00:40:37,720 --> 00:40:42,160
was a home scholar and came to
FAMU and, and, and really she's

593
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:45,480
the one who really shared with
us the merits of the program.

594
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:51,520
And when she introduced it, she
says HBC us for the most part,

595
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:57,240
do not have a voice on the, the,
the national conversation

596
00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:03,000
regarding teacher preparation.
You know, at the, at that point

597
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:07,800
that she established the homes
program for us at FAMU, there

598
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:10,880
was only one other HBCU involved
and that was Bowie State.

599
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:17,320
And so she, she just really
planted a seed in me about the

600
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:21,480
urgency of us being involved in
the national discussion about

601
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:23,600
what happens around teacher
education.

602
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:29,840
The, the, the next thing I'll
share is that upon becoming a

603
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:34,640
home scholar, we all attended
Washington Week and so very

604
00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:37,960
unique situation happened that
really helped me to understand

605
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,120
the, you know, the value of our
involvement.

606
00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:47,960
We were attending a briefing at
the Department of Education and

607
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,880
so there was a just wonderful
consortium and in those days the

608
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:56,400
Home Scholars, and they still
do, put so many great people

609
00:41:56,400 --> 00:42:02,600
before our students.
A ACTE put so many great people

610
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:05,640
around and before the Home
Scholar students.

611
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:10,280
In that case, there were people
from National Board of

612
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:12,960
Professional Standards, there
were people from Katy there,

613
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:19,400
Department of Ed and other great
organizations, American

614
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:23,240
Institute of Research was there.
And so the conversation started

615
00:42:23,240 --> 00:42:29,120
happening and at some point I
felt compelled to speak on one

616
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:32,000
of the topics.
And it was it had something to

617
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,440
do with with, you know, my
wheelhouse.

618
00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:38,480
And in that moment, as I was
speaking and looking around room

619
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:42,920
to see the engagement of other
people there, I realized right

620
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:46,560
then and there that there was a
space for our voice in the

621
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,480
national conversation.
What Doctor Moore said to us

622
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:54,040
months, months earlier really,
really made sense to me at that

623
00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:56,640
space.
You know, obviously there's a

624
00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:02,000
certain level of, of trepidation
among some of us, you know, that

625
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,920
those who sit highest up in the
ivory tower know, you know, know

626
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:09,640
so much more and you know, are,
and, and sometimes, you know,

627
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:14,800
there's a tendency to maybe feel
outclassed, right, in terms of,

628
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:18,280
of, of what you know.
But I, I want to help anyone

629
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:20,760
struggling with that to
eradicate that notion because

630
00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:27,120
there are spaces that are, that
are best served by the, the, the

631
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:29,960
voice of HBCU teacher educators,
right?

632
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:34,360
There are spaces that are best
served by a diverse perspective

633
00:43:35,280 --> 00:43:38,200
in all fields of endeavour, but
particularly in education where

634
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:40,800
the disparity still exists among
certain groups.

635
00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:46,040
And so, you know, I, I then
became undaunted with the, the,

636
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:50,440
you know, the mission of
speaking and, and, and, and

637
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:53,520
telling, you know, the world
over, particularly within HB,

638
00:43:53,720 --> 00:43:59,640
the A A/C TE community that HBC
us and the teacher education

639
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:04,440
voice within HBC US matters,
right, as my sure suggest.

640
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:09,000
And you know, it's been a good
situation since then because

641
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:13,480
there are people who agree with
that and, and who embrace the

642
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:18,520
understanding that our voice
should be amplified.

643
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:25,800
Not the least of those people
was Lynn Gangon and also our

644
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:30,400
current CEO, Cheryl Holcomb
McCoy, who has been extremely

645
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:33,680
supportive of the HBCU tag.
I want to take the opportunity

646
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:37,280
to thank her for that, you know,
while, while we're here.

647
00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:44,160
Brilliant, brilliant, brilliant.
Thank you for tuning in to Add

648
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,560
up Accelerated Excellence, the
podcast for the advancement of

649
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:49,760
educational excellence and
equity.

650
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:55,840
And we would like to share 2
wonderful opportunities for

651
00:44:56,400 --> 00:45:00,240
educators, policy makers,
advocates, and scholars to

652
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:04,840
engage in community.
First is with our Add Up

653
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:09,440
Accelerated Excellence Listening
Tour because we fundamentally

654
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:15,240
believe that by listening to
others, we empower the engine of

655
00:45:15,240 --> 00:45:19,920
transformation, unlocking the
hidden insights that spark

656
00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:24,760
meaningful change.
This week, listen to a voice

657
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:29,400
that you often don't hear from
to seek out new insights about

658
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:33,760
educational excellence or equity
and share your thoughts via

659
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:41,400
voicemail at Add up xe.com.
That's add up xe.com and your

660
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:45,720
thoughts may be shared on air
through this podcast.

661
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:51,560
That's the XE listening tour at
Add Up xe.com.

662
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:57,120
In addition, Deans, directors,
and faculty of educator

663
00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:01,480
preparation programs, we invite
you to submit nominations for

664
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:06,600
Outstanding Future Teachers for
the Accelerated Excellence

665
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:11,360
Future Teacher Award.
Research informs us that

666
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:15,120
teaching is one of the most
rewarding professions and one

667
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:18,360
upon which all others are
dependent.

668
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:25,000
So help us in elevating educator
preparation by nominating an

669
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:29,160
outstanding future teacher for
the Accelerated Excellence

670
00:46:29,160 --> 00:46:34,440
Future Teacher Award 2020 Five
2026.

671
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:37,960
Find more details in the show
notes.

672
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:48,680
So I'm going to, if you don't
mind engaging in a rapid fire, a

673
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:52,400
few questions, particularly
around the theme of this series,

674
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:57,920
which is excellence, equity and
evolution with the focus on HBC

675
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:02,240
US.
So you, as you just mentioned,

676
00:47:02,240 --> 00:47:07,000
have called for a stronger
national voice of HBC US in

677
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:09,480
educator in education, but
particularly educated

678
00:47:09,480 --> 00:47:12,480
preparation.
What perspectives do HBC US

679
00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:18,400
bring that are often overlooked?
Well, I would say this the

680
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:21,520
innovation right it is, is
enough.

681
00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:26,440
The different ways of thinking
about things obviously aren't

682
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:29,280
knowing that you know, students
learn differently and different

683
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:36,120
approaches work right.
I think as we you know share our

684
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:40,080
story and and what is happening
is an extremely valuable to the

685
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:43,280
broader community of, of, of
teachers and teacher leaders.

686
00:47:43,640 --> 00:47:47,760
I would love to lead a
consortium of HBCU teacher aid

687
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:51,280
programs from some of the
institutions I have mentioned,

688
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:54,600
but also from the Clark
Atlanta's of the world and North

689
00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:56,600
Carolina A&T's and North
Carolina Central's and

690
00:47:56,600 --> 00:47:57,760
Fayetteville States of the
world.

691
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:02,520
To help engage more with the
broader teacher Ed community.

692
00:48:02,520 --> 00:48:06,600
To, to, to share some of the,
the, the success stories that

693
00:48:06,600 --> 00:48:10,760
have led to those high numbers
of, of black teacher graduates

694
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:14,200
in an effort to, to, to help
those institutions as well.

695
00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:19,720
You know, I, I just think we do
a, a really good job of teacher

696
00:48:19,720 --> 00:48:23,920
education and the more we share,
I think the better it is for

697
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:28,240
the, for the overall community
within a CTE and, and, and

698
00:48:28,240 --> 00:48:31,160
teacher Ed.
And how would you say that

699
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:35,840
equity is operationalizing the
work of the A/C THBCU tag?

700
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:45,720
Well, we are extremely fortunate
to have partners within a CTE

701
00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:52,280
who come from all backgrounds to
help and lend support to to our

702
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:56,960
mission.
You know, some of those who come

703
00:48:56,960 --> 00:49:00,920
to mind is the the Branch
Alliance for Educator Diversity

704
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:04,320
or Educator Excellence.
I think is, is the new term

705
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:11,640
Doctor Cassandra Herring and her
wonderful staff, which is a, a

706
00:49:11,640 --> 00:49:17,520
very ethnically diverse set of
organization that helps to

707
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:21,600
support not just HBCUS, but
Hsis, right?

708
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:25,360
And you know, what happens
amongst our native populations

709
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:28,440
in terms of education, they're
all over the place, right?

710
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:33,400
And, and that multiple, those
multiple voices that contribute

711
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:37,280
to that organization are helping
us in support of many ways.

712
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:42,480
And, and also the, the support
that we get from, you know, the

713
00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:45,680
A A/C TES administration as
well.

714
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:49,920
And helping us to establish the
Gloria Ladson Billings Award for

715
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:54,360
Excellence in Teacher Education,
which is an HBCU specific award

716
00:49:54,360 --> 00:50:03,160
that we give out to HBCU, those
who either were educated at or

717
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:09,280
work at an HBCU or just who care
enough to lend support to HBC

718
00:50:09,320 --> 00:50:12,760
us.
We honor people each year with

719
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:18,920
that, you know, we're committed
to having a conversation across

720
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:25,040
multiple, you know, types of
institutions and, and different

721
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:27,720
educational leaders to help
contribute to the work that we

722
00:50:27,720 --> 00:50:31,200
do.
We brought in Cape before to

723
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:34,840
help us to better understand
some of the the challenges that

724
00:50:34,840 --> 00:50:36,800
are taking place with the
accreditation.

725
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:43,120
And we will continue to to be
open to collaboration with other

726
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:47,160
groups where we can learn and
also provide insights to them as

727
00:50:47,160 --> 00:50:50,680
well.
And looking ahead 15 to 20

728
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:57,920
years, how will the tag have
shaped HBCU teacher preparation?

729
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:03,720
Well, I hope that this tag
continues to amplify the

730
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:07,200
efficacy of HBCU teacher
preparation.

731
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:13,120
First, I would love for more of
our HBCU teacher Ed folks within

732
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:17,240
our midst.
We have 26 institutions that are

733
00:51:17,520 --> 00:51:22,680
a CTE member institutions who
have membership within our tag.

734
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:27,080
We hope to continue to amplify
those voices, to continue to

735
00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:31,480
connect on a national level
regarding policy, to continue to

736
00:51:31,960 --> 00:51:35,520
coordinate on a state level
regarding the things that are

737
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:41,480
happening in the states, right.
You know, ultimately I would

738
00:51:41,480 --> 00:51:47,680
love to see an increase and
those who attend HBCUS to study

739
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:52,200
teacher education, having a more
robust knowledge and

740
00:51:52,200 --> 00:51:56,200
understanding of how great HBCU
teacher education programs are

741
00:51:56,200 --> 00:52:00,360
hope to be a, you know, a part
of that work.

742
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:05,320
I would also like to see a
continued recognition of the

743
00:52:05,320 --> 00:52:09,480
great things that HBCUS are
doing already.

744
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:16,360
We have collaborated with the
Urban Ed Journal and we produced

745
00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:19,680
just this year there's a new
publication, a special edition

746
00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:22,520
on HBCU teacher education
programs.

747
00:52:22,920 --> 00:52:26,800
We're extremely proud of that
because what that does is it

748
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:32,200
allows our faculty and, and,
and, and those who work at HBC

749
00:52:32,240 --> 00:52:38,320
us to, to share our story, to,
to demonstrate the rigor and

750
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:40,560
research activity that is taking
place.

751
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:47,400
We produced 7 publications out
of that special edition in that

752
00:52:48,720 --> 00:52:51,480
top tier journal of urban
education.

753
00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:56,680
And I think that foreshadows a,
a, a good path forward for us.

754
00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:59,240
And, and we look forward to
future engagements and more

755
00:52:59,240 --> 00:53:03,640
publications so that the world
can learn more about what we do

756
00:53:03,720 --> 00:53:06,800
and, and the the special nature
of our our programs.

757
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:10,960
And we're speaking with Doctor
Terence McNeil, who is chair of

758
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:17,400
the A, A/C THBCU Topical Action
Group, as well as associate

759
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:20,720
professor in the Department of
Educational Practice and

760
00:53:20,720 --> 00:53:23,000
Leadership at Tennessee State
University.

761
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:25,240
And you talked about moving
forward.

762
00:53:25,240 --> 00:53:26,800
So I'm looking towards the
future.

763
00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:33,760
So Terence, what is next for the
tag or what's next in your

764
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:38,160
professional work and how might
the add up accelerated

765
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:41,640
excellence community engage in
either of those?

766
00:53:42,560 --> 00:53:48,200
Well, we are continuing to to
build our tag membership.

767
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:53,520
We are continuing to invite
those to to lean in with us.

768
00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:59,400
We're looking forward to a, a
forum that we'll have our

769
00:53:59,400 --> 00:54:01,480
general body meeting is, is
coming up.

770
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:07,920
So those in the, in the A A/C,
TE community who are interested

771
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:11,200
in our tag can join us.
Whether you're HBCU affiliated

772
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,640
or not, we'd appreciate your
presence and your support.

773
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:17,840
So we do have an upcoming
meeting May 21st on that.

774
00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:25,240
We will also hear from the A,
A/C, TE leadership regarding

775
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:27,720
legislative updates that are
taking place.

776
00:54:27,720 --> 00:54:33,640
As you know, this is a volatile
time as it relates to what is

777
00:54:33,640 --> 00:54:36,160
happening in higher education in
in general.

778
00:54:36,480 --> 00:54:40,360
And so once again, our partners
are in the A/C TE executive

779
00:54:40,360 --> 00:54:45,680
offices are leaning in to help
us and brief our, our tag on

780
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:50,640
some of those updates into a
ACTE Washington week where we

781
00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:55,160
will have a delegation of our
tag participating in Washington

782
00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:57,680
Week this year, June 1st through
3rd.

783
00:54:58,120 --> 00:55:01,440
And we're really looking forward
to, to, to that support.

784
00:55:01,800 --> 00:55:07,640
Beyond that, we'll be continuing
again to, to to work on special

785
00:55:07,640 --> 00:55:12,040
editions and continue to publish
as an institution.

786
00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:17,640
You know, this conversation
about HBC US and HBCU leadership

787
00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:21,080
is especially relevant and
germane to me.

788
00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:24,800
I feel in some ways I'm trying
to do the work of my mentor,

789
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:28,480
Doctor Frederick S Humphries,
who was an outstanding HBCU

790
00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:32,240
leader.
Personally, I'm I'm I'm writing

791
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:35,280
and and doing finishing touches
on his memoir.

792
00:55:36,160 --> 00:55:42,480
Dr. Humphries passed away and in
2021 after having LED Tennessee

793
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:46,240
State as its president and
Florida A&M as its president.

794
00:55:46,480 --> 00:55:50,400
So as a professor, personally, I
draw quite a bit from the

795
00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:52,320
insights and the leadership that
he's given me.

796
00:55:53,000 --> 00:55:57,040
So on a on a personal note, I
will be amplifying that message

797
00:55:57,200 --> 00:56:01,560
through the publishing of his
memoir coming in the coming in

798
00:56:01,560 --> 00:56:04,440
the coming year.
A blessed memory.

799
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:12,280
And the A A/C TEHVTU tag meeting
is on May the 21st.

800
00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:15,320
Is that online or in person?
That would be online.

801
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:18,080
It's a general body.
Meeting, so all are welcome.

802
00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:21,720
We have a, you know, a full
slate of things to discuss and

803
00:56:21,720 --> 00:56:24,720
to cover.
We're looking for those who want

804
00:56:24,720 --> 00:56:30,160
to work with us to lean in and I
look forward to just having a a

805
00:56:30,160 --> 00:56:33,680
good spirited discussion and
then a ATTE.

806
00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:38,320
Washington Week is June 1
through three that is in person

807
00:56:38,320 --> 00:56:42,000
in Washington, DC So Terence, I
want to thank you for this

808
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:46,040
opportunity to learn with and
from you here at Add Up

809
00:56:46,040 --> 00:56:49,080
Accelerated Excellence where we
seek to advance educational

810
00:56:49,080 --> 00:56:52,000
excellence and equity.
Well, thank you and thank you

811
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:54,520
for the work that you're.
Doing Doctor Easley, you've

812
00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:57,800
always been a leader in our
spaces and we appreciate you

813
00:56:57,800 --> 00:57:01,520
being a leader in this new
platform oh wow I really

814
00:57:01,520 --> 00:57:03,120
appreciate it and I received.
It thank you.

815
00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:06,640
Thank you for engaging with Ed
Up Accelerated Excellence, a

816
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:10,600
member of the Ed Up Experience
network of educational podcasts.

817
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:12,960
A special thanks to our research
assistant.

818
00:57:13,160 --> 00:57:16,880
Emma Worthington, APHD student
of Fordham University School

819
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:19,480
Psychology program, and we want
to hear from you.

820
00:57:19,760 --> 00:57:23,080
If you have feedback on this or
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821
00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:27,920
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822
00:57:27,920 --> 00:57:30,040
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823
00:57:30,240 --> 00:57:34,720
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824
00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:38,200
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825
00:57:38,200 --> 00:57:42,240
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826
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:45,120
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